Claudia von Boeselager: Welcome to another episode of the Longevity and Lifestyle Podcast. I'm your host, Claudia von Boeselager, here to uncover the groundbreaking tools and strategies and practices from the world's leading experts to help you live your best and reach your highest potential.

If you haven't done so already, make sure to go to LLinsider.com to get my weekly newsletter with the latest tips, insights, and other fun nuggets. My guest today is Adele Wimsett. Adele is a women's health practitioner and with a special interest in supporting women and girls with how their hormones affect their diagnosed or undiagnosed A D H D traits.

Being diagnosed with A D H D at the age of 41, Adele has seen how hormones have played a huge role in experiencing A D H D traits. Adele has embarked on a journey of retraining in women's health so that she can be the voice to help women understand their body's need. Welcome Adele to the Longevity and Lifestyle Podcast.

I'm so delighted to have you on, especially as me personally. I'm going through this journey also with my daughter and understanding where things are. Really delighted to have you on Adele. 

Adele Wimsett: I'm excited to be here. Give me a soapbox, talk about A D H D and I'll take it. So I'm excited to get into it with you.

Claudia von Boeselager: Super exciting. Yeah. Thank you. So for those listening that might not be that familiar with the term A D H D. Could you expand a little bit on, what is A D H D? Why is it so talked about now at the moment in particular. We can look a little bit about research statistics that have come up in a moment. But just to start with, can you expand and explain what is ADHD? 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah, absolutely. So it stands for Attention Deficit Hyperactive Disorder, which is a really rubbish name for it. And actually most people with ADHD don't align to that at all. But it's actually an umbrella term that captures three different subtypes of A D H D.

So it's a neurological condition. We're thought to be an 80% genetic link. And the three subtypes are inattentive, which we tend to see a lot more in girls, which we can come onto. But it tends to be this sort of daydreamy much more internal type behaviors. Then we have the other end of that spectrum, which is hyper, very hyperactive, which is what we tend to associate much more with, like a child bouncing off the walls in the classroom, not following any compliance and listening, but there's a lot of hyperactivity that we can see inwardly, it can be hyper speech, which full disclosure, sorry if I speak too quickly and hyper thought, we can't unhook our thoughts.

We've got all these thoughts racing around, so it's not just behavioral. And then there's combined type, which I am, which is a mixture of two. So that's the umbrella term for what ADHD stands for. And it can present differently in everybody. There's a saying in the A D H D community, just because you've met one person with ADHD, you've met one person with ADHD.

That's it. It's very different, which I think has been one of the challenges with diagnosis, particularly when we start to drill down into how differently it presents in females. So does that answer that question for you? 

Claudia von Boeselager: Yeah, I think it's really helpful. I know in the US you have also ADD attention deficit disorder, which is, I guess more the first end of the spectrum you were referring to. 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah. We don't use that term. We don't use ADD anymore. And that, as you said, was the inattentive element. It's just all now under this umbrella term. 

Claudia von Boeselager: Is there any reasoning behind that, out of interest? 

Adele Wimsett: I don't know. I think there's a lot of pressure at the moment to try to move A D H D into this decade with understanding around it. And it's quite challenging because so much is misunderstood. So much isn't, known. There's so much that we don't understand about it. So I think people are trying to maybe pull things together, but I dunno the exact reason or cause of that.

Claudia von Boeselager: Yeah, no, I understand. So in my research I found a study that showed between 2007 and 2016 that the incidence of adult A D H D showed up by 123% in the US alone. Which is far outpacing the rates of increase of child and adolescent cases as well. So what, in your view is the reasoning behind this exponential increase in A D H D cases?

Adele Wimsett: Well, that will depend who you speak to on which day, because there are various opinions on what this is, some of the more controversial than others.

So it's about what kind of feels aligned to you. I think with anything we're advancing all the time in our understanding of some of these conditions. Try not to be too controversial with some of the perspectives on it. so I think that probably plays a large role in what has brought it to the forefront.

It has traditionally and conventionally very much sat with a condition of naughty little boys that people grow out of, you grow outta this. And that's not the case. The more we've understood it, the more we've seen that it is an adult condition and then the more understanding it in girls, which is why that's expanding massively at the moment.

So personally for me, I think it's understanding and as science develops, as medical knowledge develops an understanding of this, it's natural that we then see this increase because suddenly it's understood. That for me, seems the strongest theory. 

Claudia von Boeselager: That makes sense. I think as well. And the understanding is there, and maybe also that it's more acceptable to try to get a diagnosis versus maybe in the past people what might have been ashamed or were, denying it, etc..
Adele Wimsett: Absolutely, and I think we have more information available to us now. It's more accessible than ever before. Certainly that's something we've seen in just even recent months, and years than number of people stepping forward for diagnosis because of social media, going, "oh my gosh, that is me!" That explains everything, explains my entire life in a one minute TikTok video, you know, we're starting to access this kind of information that is giving us this whole understanding to go, 'oh my gosh, I'm ready to reach out for help.' Because obviously I specialize in working with women, so that is my bias with what I see in my community. But we've gone down a rabbit hole before we reach out for help.

A woman doesn't just wake up and say, I think I've got A D H D, and I'm gonna tell everyone that, I want a label. But there's this judgment about it. We've probably gone down a rabbit hole, questioned ourselves a million times, we'll see that we've got virtually all the traits, but there'll be one we haven't got.

And we go, oh no, I'm making it up. I haven't got that. You know, we go down this real journey with it. Even when we go to a point of diagnosis and go, am I? Am I? Is this right? We're making it up. So it's a really deep journey and I think the amount of Information that's available to us has played a big role in the expansion of diagnosis.

Claudia von Boeselager: Yeah, no, that makes sense. And I'd love to just take a step back, Adele, for a moment and talk about your journey and if you could share that, where is your passion of becoming an expert in this area come from? Can you share. 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah, of course. So my background wasn't always in women's health. My background was in youth justice and one of my lead areas within that was female offending.

And another lead within that was special educational needs. So I had quite a robust understanding of A D H D in offenders, this kind of typical type behavior. But one of my roles within that was having responsibility for managing all different types of practitioners from different organizations.

And I remember having a probably about 15 years ago now a conversation with a psych who was like, I never considered getting diagnosed with ADHD. And I was like, yeah, I've probably got it, but what's the point? Because on paper I had been very successful in inverted comments. I did very well academically as a child, I'd always done really well in my career.

Not as well my IQ interestingly did not tally up with the grades I actually got, but they were still good and I was such a good girl. I was little miss Perfect all of the time and strive for perfection, I did really well in my career and actually had more misdiagnosed. I've never had a mental health diagnosis in that sense, but more anxiety type behavior, that overwhelmness burnout, boom kind of behavior that we see. And then several years ago, I started to learn more about it and I thought, Actually, why not get a diagnosis. I was seeing some of this in my children.

I've got two little girls, for me personally, it was important that I went through that process if my children were going to. And it was the most validating experience of my life, which shocked me actually, because I was like, 'oh, well, I know, but I'm still doing that, but am I? am I?' And then when the psych told me, I just bursted out crying.

I was like, I've never felt so seen in my life. He said, 'do you do this? Do you do this? Do you do this?' 'Yeah, doesn't everybody? he's like, 'no,' ' oh, ok.' And then suddenly I think the gift for me was the amount of compassion and kindness. I was then able to offer myself of why I behave and I think the way that I do. That was the big game changer for me. 

Claudia von Boeselager: That's so helpful. And I think for people listening, I haven't had a diagnosis yet officially going through the process with my daughter as well. And I've told her that I'm pretty sure I have adhd, so I'm educating myself. I have the books. She's wondering what's going on.

And I think for children it's tough because you don't want to give them a label. Even for adults I guess as well or, learn the vocabulary around it to embrace neurodiversity. But, I'm curious, you were just saying that you'd have more compassion for yourself, but what were some game changers that having that diagnosis, gave to you? What were some big changes and shifts that happened once you had the diagnosis?

Adele Wimsett: I think it was just being gentle with myself. It was understanding myself, some of the behaviors and things that I do to go, oh, that's why I do it. I'll go in the car and I'm like, a number of times I get round the block and I'm like, oh God, did I turn the hair straightens off? Did I da da da? And it's not O C D behavior. Because I do forget that stuff sometimes because I'm distracted doing something else and I'll leave it on. So it's very real and understanding the strategies I had subconsciously put into my life to make my life like it was.

And that's where I was like, well, everyone doesn't do this? You know, Realizing my passion for my love of yoga and breath work and how I look after myself, actually, that wasn't just because I liked doing them. They were fundamental to me surviving in a neurotypical world. But I hadn't acknowledged that or realized that.

I just learned things that made me feel better and in quite a deep way. So it's really this process of I'm picking things and like you say, everyone has such a different experience. For me, I wanted to stand on top of mountains and go, 'oh my gosh, there's nothing wrong with me!' I kinda have that messaging, but, other people can feel the complete opposite.

And some women feel real shame and feel really embarrassed because of stereotypical beliefs around A D H D. So it's a very personal journey, but for me and I'm still un-picking it, it's still unfolding. It's still that reflection of like, That's why I do what I do. That's why I wanna know everything and learn everything.

That's why if someone speaks to me, really slowly like this, inside, I'm screaming in my head, you just start to learn about yourself. It's like an unfolding. That's just it. For me, a lot of it has been a very beautiful experience, but I have a lot of supportive people around me and a lot of ADHD people around me. I think I start suddenly realizing that you just attract them. 

Claudia von Boeselager: I think I could confirm that as well. The typical careers of ADHD people that can multi- task, even though for the brain, obviously that's not the best. But I was listening to an interview. The name I've blanked on this moment, but, I really like the emphasis that, neurodiverse people have very strong gifts in certain areas, and I really like that shift in perspective of actually making that enormous. This is not a disability, it's actually a gift in certain areas.

And I think for people that are maybe suffering or maybe have this and just don't want to get a diagnosis or don't understand to realize, you have a superpower, you have a gift, and use this as a motivation to realize, like uncover your gift. And we can't be perfect at everything. And I think the new philosophy is not like, in schooling, correct all your weaknesses so you can try to keep up with the others, but no, focus on your strength. And just thrive on that. Those are your gifts as well, right? 

Adele Wimsett: Absolutely. And I know that can be like for some people, when they hear about A D H D being a superpower, that could feel really triggering for them because it feels really challenging. But I would not swap my brain for a neurotypical brain, when my daughter was diagnosed, she was like, I really hope that I am, because it'll be so boring if I was neurotypical. That's her perception, but that's not to take away the challenge that exists. But for me, that's not my problem.

My A D H D is not a problem to me, largely because of the life I've been able to create, where my challenges actually are manageable and I've created life where I have a lot of flexibility and a lot of freedom and a lot of creativity and all of these things, and I do things that I love and have so much passion about.

But when we are not able to embrace the gifts of it and we're stuck in a little box with lots of rules and (bluh) around us. Yes, it feels like a disability because it feels so oppressive and for a lot of people. But actually I think it's the way society is. That is the problem, and my favorite theory about A D H D is actually that where we evolved, that actually part of our evolutionary progression was that there were hunters, and there were gatherers. And actually ADHDers fit the hunter where you had to be out and there was a rabbit running that way, a deer running that way. And you had to make a decision. You didn't have time to analyze it and make a logical decision.

It had to be rational. What am I doing? Very quickly. So the gifts of our brain, the way our brains were, fit beautifully with that. But society and culture has evolved in a way where they aren't necessarily the strengths that fit nicely into a school system or into a nine to five system, into a very compliant, don't think out the box just do as you're told until you retire. We don't wanna do that, so therefore we're a problem. Do you see what I mean? And that's how I feel about it. actually we just wanna live in a different way, but it's really difficult when the world doesn't work that way. 

Claudia von Boeselager: That's a really interesting point you're making because I think there's a fundamental shift slowly happening in schooling. The whole school system going back now is based on training people to go work in factories, industrial revolution type of workplace, listen to commands and orders, but actually know the world is changing fundamentally. But also with machine learning, artificial intelligence, etc. So actually we need humans to be more creative, great idea makers, public speaking, all these other facets as well. Potentially in sort of the new developments happening, ADHDers are going to thrive in particular because of that creativity, flexibility, adaptability, that comes with some of these traits as well. So I think it's a process happening slowly but surely. But I've been reading up also that neurodiversity is very much embraced because they realize that these are particular gifts and there are particular strengths that these people bring with them as well. So very interesting space to be watched for sure. 

I'd love to ask you a question regarding gender differences. How does A D H D affect men and women differently? 

Adele Wimsett: Oh, do you know what, this is such a broader question. We've forgotten that men and women are different, we know that we are, but there is this big thing in medicine that's widely acknowledged called the gender bias.

And there is nowhere more so that this stands out than with A D H D. And this is because the vast majority of research, and I'll come on to explaining the differences, but I think it's important to put this context. The vast majority of research and studies have been undertaken on men in all kinds of things in medicine and lifestyle, medicine and functional and health. Even lab rats tend to be male. And if women are included in studies, we tend to shut their cycle down with the pill to make it flat, flat line so we don't ebb and flow is our hormones do naturally, which is a whole other ethical issue. So what we have about real data, about what works for menstruating women and girls that are cycling growing up, it practically non-existent because it makes us more complex and therefore more expensive to research.

So what we have is this huge body of information about what works for male physiology and women get treated as small men, completely ignoring the impact our endocrinology, our hormone system have on every system in our body. Okay, so from a physiological level, the way A D H D can show up for us can be cyclical.

Our traits can be cyclical, so sometimes we can function much better and our traits are much more manageable because of the role the hormones are playing in the body. And at other times when those hormones drop off, the lid comes off and we feel really overwhelmed and it's really challenging, and we think, oh my gosh, I can't do this.

But then our hormones kick back in. We're like, oh, she's having a bad week. And I think this is one of the reasons we have this delay in diagnosis because men do the same thing from puberty to death, from a hormone perspective, they get a bit of a decline in testosterone, but that's it. Whereas women have phases, these fluctuations every single month that affect our cognitive function, our emotional regulation amongst many, many other things. Whereas men don't have that. But the research around A D H D was done on little boys who then turned into men. So we have this information, this understanding, but what we know to be true or what we're seeing to be true at the moment is that little girls tend to fall more into this inattentive category.

Now, if you were a teacher, And you had to manage a class of 30 children and you've got a little boy fitting into the hyperactive mode and being very external with his behavior, or a little girl sitting quietly trying to be a good girl because boys don't have this gender expectation that girls do. They have a different expectation, but they get boys will be boys.

Girls don't have that now. We are taught very young age that it's rude to interrupt, you don't finish people's sentence, you don't jump around, you don't do all these things. So we learn subconsciously to be a good girl mask. Push all these bits in your personality down and just be really, really good. So that no one notices that you are not a good girl. So we sit in a classroom, generally, this isn't everybody and boys can behave like this too. Generally we can sit in a classroom and be a really good girl. But the inner turmoil, that inner hyperactivity is completely masked, and it's usually when the hormones kick in around adolescence that the lid off. And we start to see quite different behaviors. But the problem here is that because we're not presenting a problem generally in the classroom, we don't get picked up. so therefore they're not, because we have this outdated gender stereotypical view of A D H D assessments aren't supported by educators, for example, which then means these girls become the lost girls until we become old enough to identify this for ourselves.

Now, I believe this is changing now as mums like yourself are becoming much more aware going, wait a minute. But if these supporting practitioners who have to support an ADHD diagnosis, because your opinion alone isn't enough, your experience of your child alone isn't enough for a diagnosis, then we leave these girls open to massive risk factors as they get older and we can start to see increased risks around eating disorders, harmful behavior, teenage pregnancy, substance issues, unhealthy relationships. I'm ticking most of these boxes myself. You know, as teenagers, they kind of come up. And then we start to see in women, we don't fit into the good woman model. For a lot of us, we don't wanna do domestic duties because they're really boring. If they were interesting and we'd be great at them. So it's almost like debilitating to look at that pile of ironing and it tortures us. It's like, do the ironing, do the ironing, do the ironing, do the ironing until your head feels like it's gonna explode. And then you do like three months worth in one go. So we see for women, we can start to present as like sometimes social feeling quite anxious socially because we know that we say the wrong thing or we can be inappropriate or, you know, so we learn to avoid those situations because we can make too many personal disclosures or be silent, there's these very subtle differences with how it can show up in girls, but it can be different for everybody. Does that answer your question? 

Claudia von Boeselager: A hundred percent. And I've also had an episode on the female biorhythm as well, and how women try to work in the workplace like men, but they have a 24-hour testosterone cycle versus the women's one.
What are the hormones that most impact symptoms or traits of ADHD?

Adele Wimsett: So this is really interesting. So at the moment here in the uk, we're trying to push for an A D H D Act here, and I'm leading on the women's working party around that. So part of that was to undertake effectively a literature review on the research around hormones and adhd.

Surprise, suprise there isn't very much out there at all. So what I share with you in full disclosure is based on my clinical experience and the teeny pinpricks of evidence that we have. Overarching, I would say that we cannot look at hormones in isolation when we're looking at neurodiverse behavior because they all work together.

What I do see in my experience is that women tend to have more hormonal imbalances around insulin dysregulation, cortisol dysregulation, thyroid. There's a link with P C O S. We're actually high risk of type two diabetes, so we're starting to see that there is this hormonal imbalance. But in terms of our traits, and they will all affect our traits, all of those imbalances, if we experience them, will affect our traits.
Now, particularly ones that we tend to look at are estrogen and progesterone and what we're starting to see is that estrogen sensitizes dopamine. Now, when I was explaining what A D H D was, dopamine is one of the neurotransmitters that we think plays a role in A D H D type behavior. We don't really understand what, how, or why, but it plays a role.

So what we see in women is that during their follicular phase. The start of their cycle, we see this rise in estrogen, which sensitizes neurotransmitters and makes our traits much more manageable because the brain's kind of like, oh, I hate looking at that ironing, but if I'm gonna do it, it's probably gonna be during this phase right? And we can be much more sociable. Our cognitive function is better, our mood balance is better. Although interestingly, a lot of women that I see, which seems to be specific to ADHD women, is when estrogen really peaks, they can to feel these PMT type symptoms and feel really like frazzled and anxiety, which is interesting and my hypothesis on that, is that we almost go into like a dopamine toxicity that we go from like feast to famine, and it's quite overwhelming. But again, there's no research to back that up. That's purely in my hypothesis. 

Now, estrogen is like, she's the party girl of the hormone family. She's sexy, she's outgoing, she's sociable, she's energized, but left her own devices she's a problem. Which is why she has this beautiful relationship with her sister Progesterone, who's like the yoga chill girl in the party, right? So she's like calm down estrogen. In the second half of the cycle, she supports with something called gaba, which is really calming, so it supports sleep. 

However, the complexity here is for neurodiverse women or some neurodiverse women that estrogen high, we've been enjoying around our traits. Progesterone comes in and reigns on our parade, and it's like we kind of have this shift down. So what we see is that women with A D H D are 10 times more likely to experience extreme P M T, like PMDD, more at risk of postnatal depression, which I believe is this reduction in estrogen. And more likely to experience PMT. So, and I believe that it's to do with this role progesterone plays in dampening down the effect of estrogen. Again, we dunno very much about that. 

Now, also within that, in terms of medication, what we're starting to see is that estrogen actually makes the amphetamine. If people choose to go down a medication route, it actually makes the medication more effective, but then progesterone makes it less effective. So women can be doing quite well on their meds for like three weeks of their cycle, but then that final week is like, oh, my meds aren't working anymore. So they can be told to increase their medication to make that season easier. I actually believe there's a lot of lifestyle things that you can do to support that season, which would times what you were just talking about they're our cyclical nature. So actually by honoring that phase and working with that phase a bit differently in terms of how you look after yourself, may not mean you need to mess around with meds, but we have this issue that our A D H D therapist is not talking to our hormone provider and so the team never meets. So you have to be this bit in the middle advocating for yourself by saying, look at what's happening to my cycle. There's this effect. I need this to be combined in my treatment plan. 
And for women who have hormone deficiencies. For example, progesterone during the first phase of Perimenopause may need to go and advocate for themselves to have conversations around H R T rather than changing their A D H D meds. And that's gonna be a very personal experience for every single woman. 

Claudia von Boeselager: Can you just expand on that point? Cause I think it is so fundamental. I've had Dr. Louise Newson, I'm sure you're familiar with who's a big advocate around perimenopausal and menopause, and just raising awareness and how many women suffer needlessly, if they were to get the right support in place. Can you expand a little bit around that perimenopausal, menopausal space for women in this age category, which can be from the age of 35, right. 

Adele Wimsett: Absolutely. And I think this comes back to, again, highlighting this point, we're different to men. Men don't have these distinct hormonal phases.
We do. We have menarche, which is our first period. We have our fertile years. We have postnatal, we have perimenopause and postmenopause. So we have these distinct hormonal phases where things are very different for us. And therefore, as I said earlier, we're affecting all these different systems. And what we're seeing is a huge number of women getting diagnosed for A D H D during perimenopause.

And that is because of coming back to estrogen, going all over the place, which has been keeping us going, during our fertile years. Progesterone dropping off a cliff, which might be a good thing, might not be depending on your personal experience. And then the lid comes off with all these traits and we're like, what is going on?
And actually being able to access HRT. Women that I work with find that that might be actually what it is that they need. Now, H R T. I'm a massive fan of body identical HRT used correctly with the support of the right person who really understands H R T and used with other lifestyle changes. It's not always the golden ticket women and some women can't have it, and there are other things that you can look at and other options.

I'm totally happy if anyone ever wanted to message me or to get support with this, to really advocate for yourself. If this is speaking to you as being in this position to bring in H R T as part of your package around A D H D, but your healthcare provider might look at you like you're an alien if you say, I'd like some HRT to support my ADHD traits.

Claudia von Boeselager: So I'm taking part in a clinical trial and doing early H R T for estrogen testosterone. Cause my levels are also very low and I find it super helpful as well. Focus, concentration, things like that too. And I think also postpartum because the hormones are complete havoc I think that makes the challenges, let's say, of postpartum with lack of sleep and everything else around so much more difficult, and that ADHD for many can just really be off the charts as well. What would you recommend new mothers in this space? That everyone's sort of like, yes, having a newborn is difficult. Like when should someone seek out help? 

Adele Wimsett: So interestingly, motherhood can be the time that ADHD women realize they've got ADHD, because like I was doing all right before, what is this? I thought I'd be okay. And what we have to remember with estrogen when we're pregnant, so women with A D H D can find in the second and third trimesters that their traits almost vanish because the estrogen is so high. And then a few days after giving birth, our estrogen levels can reduce by up to a thousand times. That is huge. They drop off a cliff and we're like tired. Oh my gosh. What is this? So one of the things I advise women to doing this is to have a really robust support plan in place with people around you to understand your healthcare providers.

I mean, in an ideal world, I believe that actually a lot of postnatal women probably just need some H R T and estrogen as opposed to psychiatric medication, but we are not in that world yet. And how controversial is that to say out loud, but actually maybe if we did look at that, that would support women, hold them through when we know what it does to serotonin and dopamine. To me this is a no-brainer. So it's about really understanding that that's gonna be a more vulnerable time for you. You are not failing as a mother in that phase. Your brain and chemical makeup is different to other women in that space, and therefore, the way that you manage and you cope and you support yourself during that phase needs to be different too.

Claudia von Boeselager: Really helpful. I wanna touch on the point you made before around strategies, but before we get there. In terms of seeking help, would you recommend for men and women also listening, thinking that they might have ADHD to get a formal diagnosis? What would you say are the sort of general pros and cons and are there any particular types of tests to focus on getting a diagnosis. 

Adele Wimsett: I think it's so personal. So I run a support group for ADHD women called ADHDivas, and every single woman's experience is so different. I will work with a woman whether she's diagnosed or undiagnosed, because as far as I can concern, if you've reached the point, you think you've got it, you probably have, but every woman, it depends on your circumstances.

What support are you trying to access? If you want to go down medication route, you're gonna need to get diagnosed. You're not gonna get that if you haven't got a formal diagnosis. So that's kind of a no-brainer in that sense. Do you need a formal diagnosis to get others around you to believe that this is. Because this is a big issue for A D H D people when their partner, their parents go, A D H D doesn't exist, we're all a bit ADHD. All these massively triggering comments, sometimes having a doctor who's written it down, that can be something that you need to be able to have those conversations about your support. I would say spend time with yourself to really reflect on why do you need a diagnosis, what do you want it for? Because that's a personal journey for you. So I can't say yes or no, just think, there's a financial implication. Here in the UK you're looking at about three years for a diagnosis.

If you go through the NHS. I know that private psychs are massively under pressure, but that's gonna be a lot quicker. But there's a cost implication, so there's a bit of a privilege there, right? So it's about understanding, what do you want to gain from that? What are the outcomes for you?

And sometimes the decision can be easier if you're thinking about it for your child because they've got, go through an education system who only listen if there's a piece of paper that says this child has these needs. So it's very personal. 

Claudia von Boeselager: Are there specific people that you would recommend specialists to go to for testing?

Adele Wimsett: I would say reach out to ADHD organizations and you'll have them where you are. So it's up in the uk. We've got one called head staff and they will be able to direct you to psychs who understand you and listen, because not all people who can diagnose A D H D should be. I had a woman recently who went to a doctor and was told, you can't have ADHD your a woman, oh my God, why are we having this conversation. That's what's happening, but that took her ages to get there. And that can destroy her. So I would say before you reach at out to get a medical diagnosis, do your research on who you are going to, and don't be afraid to get a second opinion. Sometimes you can get organizations who do pre-assessments who can say, actually, I think this looks like you have a lot of traits around this. It might be worth going for a full diagnosis or say, actually, no, I think maybe it's presenting as X, Y, or Z instead. So that can save you that journey.

There's loads of online screenings that you can do to start to really get into that. But in terms of one specific person to work with, there isn't anybody I can particularly recommend, particularly for women. I mean, we need more practitioners who specialize in this and really understand the impact of hormones.

Claudia von Boeselager: I'd love to discuss what are some of your top strategies, tools, routines that you do that are very A D H D friendly, lifestyle focused?

Adele Wimsett: Definitely. Do you know what? So it was really interesting that I realized that I had subconsciously done a lot of these things without realizing how powerful they are for managing A D H D. Now, full disclosure, I'm not medicated. So the way that I speak about this is from a very lifestyle perspective, from my personal choices for my life, and it might not be for everybody. 

Cold water therapy is amazing and I'm not saying I love looking at these people who just put themselves in a cold bucket every single morning. That's amazing. It's not for me. A cold shower is sufficient for me, and it does make a difference. I don't wanna do it every day, so I don't. But the days I incorporate it has a big difference moving my body everyday, in a way that I want to, that isn't going smashing the gym and producing globes of cortisol, it's moving my body, getting up and stretching, doing a yoga routine. Breath work is so powerful. Most of us have completely dysregulated H P A aXis, which are stress responses, and we have a lot of trauma held in that, usually from childhood.

Something else within that, actually with girls is something called rejection sensitivity dysphoria and this disregulates this trauma response where anything we perceive as criticism, so having people around you who understand you and don't judge you and that you can be full on ADHD with and don't have to mask it.

Being really conscious about what you eat. ADHD people struggle a lot with food because it's really boring. Preparing it, if we're not interested in it, it can involve a lot of steps. We can be distracted doing something else or hyper-focused doing things. So we can forget to eat for hours, but it disregulates our insulin and our blood sugars and that amplifies our mood dysregulation, our cognitive function.

So finding ways to really make sure you are eating, it can be quick, simple stuff. It can be a hardball day. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, but making sure you are having something to keep that blood sugar balance. So in summary, move your body. Do some breath work, eat things to balance your blood sugar and find your tribe. Get your people around you and make sure that the people supporting you understand A D H D properly.

Claudia von Boeselager: I love that. That's really helpful. And to become an advocate even as well, right? So to help educate people around it from stigma in the past to actually what this is and what it can be and how everybody's really different, particularly for girls I think as well. 

What are some bad recommendations that you hear or that clients come to you and they're like, oh, well I was told this or that. What are some things that you typically hear in this space? 

Adele Wimsett: Do you know what nothing springs to mind to me with that.
I don't know that there's so much bad recommendations because the only recommendations there tends to be is medication. There aren't a lot of other providers out there who are saying, 'This is the nutrition for A D H D. This is this exact movement for adhd.' There aren't people at the moment who are really, really standing out or offering this advice.

So I don't think it's because there isn't bad advice. I think it's because there isn't a lot of advice. So that's my honest answer is I just think there's a big gap in advice as opposed to there being a lot of bad advice. It's like, 'take these meds or you are on your own.' 

Claudia von Boeselager: Say a patient comes to you with ADHD symptoms, what would be a typical process that you bring them through and what are some of the outcomes that some of your patients are able to expect and to see? 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah, so I am really passionate about educating women because I believe there's a huge empowerment that comes there when we have to advocate for ourselves especially if we've experienced being gaslit through that process.

So by being armed with information and doing it in quite a fun way. So it isn't like a boring science lesson, but I sit with her, and their like 'oh my God, why has nobody ever told me this is what's happening to my body?' So you get that information because we love to learn, right? ADHDers be like, 'give me the information. I want to know more.'

It's never enough, right? So educating and understanding what's happening to their body and why things are happening, to advocate, to feel empowered and to be motivated to make the changes that I suggest. So that's one thing that I do. The other is I have a tool where I teach women to track their traits against their hormonal fluctuations.

And then we use menstrual cycle awareness to understand that, to apply to an A D H D friendly life from a feminine perspective. And then I offer sometimes where it's relevant hormone testing. So we will have a look at exactly what is going on. So they get this really good data that, again, you can take to healthcare providers because they love to see that. You can show it to people around you to go look at what's happening to me.

And you can create a really bespoke tailored plan around their specific, hormonal fluctuation. So I look at gut health and inflammation, liver detoxification, how the hormones are being broken down in the body. We look at cortisol, we look at insulin, we look at the thyroid and create a full picture.

Around how to balance those things because a lot of hormone imbalances can feel like ADHD traits sometimes. So what I help women to do is unpick what is the hormone imbalance and address it. What am I left with? That's what I need to manage with my A D H D plan. Does that make sense?

Claudia von Boeselager: That makes a lot of sense and especially for this community 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah. 

Claudia von Boeselager: I wonder if we could break that down a little bit to understand, and maybe you could share in your experience what role gut health, for example, plays in hormone regulation, but also in ADHD traits.

Adele Wimsett: Of course we have loads of missing data about the role that gut plays, specifically around ADHD. There's bits of it, but again, we know the role that gut plays in terms of producing neurotransmitters, like serotonin, for example. We know that. So if our gut is outta balance, it's not gonna be producing that, which puts us as a further disadvantage.

I believe there is a link with inflammation and A D H D. I don't think we properly understand it at all, but I think there's a link. So if we can support and heal the gut by reducing the inflammation there. I believe that has a knock on effect in terms of how our traits present. 

And you asked about, the role that gut plays in hormone health. And this is something that's really interesting because we've been taught to sort of think, well, our womb is down there that's sorting out estrogen and progesterone and everything else is broken up. It's a system.

And if the gut is not detoxifying and cleansing properly, we're gonna be prone to something called estrogen dominance or unopposed estrogen, and that is because estrogen gets released, it does its thing, and as I said, remember she's the party girl. We don't want her getting out control. A bit of her is a great thing, too much is a problem. So she goes to the liver, where theres two phases of her being detoxed. Okay? So if you imagine the liver kind of packs up estrogen into a nice little envelope and sends it down to the gut. Now, if the gut is outta balance, we have our own gut biome there. The gut flora, specifically for estrogen.

I mean, how incredible is that. Estrobolome it's called, I love that word. And if the gut isn't working properly there, it's gonna open that envelope of estrogen that the livers work so hard to close and put it back in the bloodstream. So then the liver's like, 'oh my God, I got rid of you and now you are back causing problems because there's too much of you.'

So we get these symptoms that can be like heavy bleeding or periods, or really horrible PMT, because you're in this estrogen dominant state. So it's not just about making sure our eastern and progesterone is being produced, but that we are clearing it and detoxifying it properly. So we're in harmony and balance, and that starts with the gut.

So we clear and support the gut and cleanse that and harmonize that. And then we move up to the liver and we work on the two phases of detoxification to make sure it's clearing. So that can be done, either based on your symptoms or you can get specific hormonal testing that I offer that can break down and say, actually this is exactly where the process is breaking down here. Looking at you holistically, its looking at your whole body and you feel better. So everything's gonna be easier.

Claudia von Boeselager: I know it's like a positive snowball effect in the right direction it's really exciting. Can you share some of the learnings and insights that your clients you've worked with have found the most valuable?

Adele Wimsett: Do you know what? It never fails to astound me how little women know about their bodies, and I didn't until I went down this path because of my personal circumstances, and I was like, 'oh my God, this explains everything.' And most of my clients will sit with me and go, ' I never hear this. Why did I never know this? Why am I only finding out now?' So for me, I think the big revelation, understanding the cyclical nature of our body, the ebb and flow, and the number of things that is influencing and affecting. And then the second revelation is how simple it is to address. It's not always easy, but it's simple.

And that's where the support comes in, around holding that space. Because any lifestyle change is challenging, right? Because how we live and we're in this mess probably because of how we've been living. So, trying to unpick some of that can take support, but it's quite simple and through making very small changes. You can feel quite drastically different. And then for me, that's really addictive, which is such an A D H D for me. I'm like, 'give more. I want more. Tell me how can I feel even better. Tell me the next hack, tell me the next trick.' And we build it. But particularly with ADHDers is what we do is go, 'you've given me the information clear, the cupboards, everything's getting thrown out.

This is what we're doing.' And then three days later we're like rocking in the corner, eating the pizza, going, 'oh my God, I'm so overwhelmed. What have I done?' So I work with ADHD women to go, that's what you wanna do, but I'm not let you. We're gonna bring it back and we're gonna bring in little tiny changes that have long-term sustainable change.

Because by nature we wanna change everything. And then we kind of go, 'that's boring now, moving on.' So it's about doing it in a way that's really sustainable. 

Claudia von Boeselager: That's phenomenal. You mentioned briefly before you've got a ADHD support group called ADHDivas right? I love the name. Can you share a little bit about that and who's it for and is it just local or for people international? 
Adele Wimsett: No, it's international. it's a space. It's a collective of women to show up who have been affected by ADHD, so it could be a mother of someone with ADHD, where you don't have to mask, you're unapologetically yourself. You can go on there in a really safe way. I mean, sometimes it's really funny, like we'll all share pictures of the room that we hide from everybody, whoever enters the house or we laugh at some of our behaviors, like, 'oh my God, thank God people come to our house and we do the Hoover.' You know, like it's so, it can be quite fun and supportive.

We normalize our traits together, but it also has a very serious side and a supportive side. So when women do have these really shitty experiences where they're told you can't have ADHD, you're a woman, there's, rather than going home and sitting on your own with that. We share lots of resources on there. There's quite often conversations about medication. By the moment. There's a conversation about mushrooms, like you name it, one minute we're talking squirrels, then we're talking about our child not being in school. It's like that. It's beautiful. It's a beautiful space and all are welcome. 

Claudia von Boeselager: Oh, that sounds beautiful. Where can people find out more about it? 

Adele Wimsett: Yeah, I'm really happy if people want to pop me a message. You're welcome to join. It's a really lovely community. I like hanging out on Instagram, usually having a round about something female health related. Just message me on there. I love speaking to people directly. I love hearing about different people's experiences. I offer free discovery calls, and I promise that if I'm not the person to work with you in that space, I will probably know somebody who will. It won't be a waste of your time, we make sure that there is a path for you or a way forward to get some support that you need. So yeah, Instagram probably best, but you can do email. It might just take me a little while to get to it. 

Claudia von Boeselager: What's your Instagram handle for those listening? 

Adele Wimsett: So harmonise you with an S.

Claudia von Boeselager: Adele, for listeners and people watching, interested in understanding A D H D and ADHD and hormones better. What are some online resources or books you'd recommend for them to start with? 

Adele Wimsett: In terms of specifically hormones and A D H D doesn't exist. But there is, Dr. Patricia Quinn is the international lead doctor raising awareness around, hormones and girls. But it's rising. You know, people are starting to pick up, but there isn't a specific book or something that I can kind of unfortunately send you to at the moment. 

Claudia von Boeselager: Yeah, exactly. It's in the process yet. Thank you for your work as well. 

Do you have any final ask or recommendation or any parting thoughts or message for my audience? 

Adele Wimsett: Please don't feel alone. Please don't think like you're going crazy. Please don't think there aren't any solutions for you because there are so many, there are so many things you can be empowered to do to make yourself feel better, and you don't have to do it on your own.

Claudia von Boeselager: Beautiful. Thank you so much, Adele, for coming on today, its been such a pleasure and so insightful also for me personally. So thank you. 

Adele Wimsett: Thank you for having me.