Dr. Cat Meyer 0:00  
sex hormones support the production of sex hormones. Stress supports the production of stress hormones. So how much are we paying attention? Where are we putting this attention? And that's going to help us to feed back loop of creating more and more and more of that thing.

Claudia von Boeselager 0:16  
Are you ready to boost your longevity and unlock peak performance? Welcome to the Longevity and Lifestyle Podcast. I'm your host Claudia von Boeselager, longevity and peak performance coach. Each week we'll explore groundbreaking science, unravel longevity secrets share strategies to grow younger and stay up to date with world-class health and peak performance pioneers. Everything you need to live longer, live better, and reach your fullest potential, ready to defy aging, optimize health, and promote peak performance, visit LLinsider.com. For more. Today's guest is Dr. Cat Meyer. Cat is a licensed psychotherapist specializing in sexual trauma and ketamine-assisted therapy, author, yoga teacher, and international speaker dedicated to evolving the relationship we have surrounding sexuality and our bodies. It's such a pleasure to welcome you to today the Longevity and Lifestyle Podcast. Dr. Cat, thank you so much for coming on.

Dr. Cat Meyer 1:22  
It's my absolute pleasure to be here. Thank you.

Claudia von Boeselager 1:25  
So I'm really excited to dive into this topic today. And I'd like to start with the fact that first of all, you help 10s of 1000s of people come back to their hearts and their bodies and create erotically inspired lives through sex, love, and yoga. What exactly does this mean? And what is it that you do? Can you share this with my audience, please?

Dr. Cat Meyer 1:47  
Yeah, so I have been a psychotherapist. So working around sexuality and trauma for the past 13 years. And the manifestation of that is really varied. So I have my own private practice where I see individuals and couples and even poly keels or whatever relationship. Yeah. And then I also hold retreats in-person retreats, I do online courses, and I do podcasting and workshops, and speaking and all the things

Claudia von Boeselager 2:22  
I love it, and part of the practice, you say about, you know, coming back to their hearts and their bodies. Why is there such? Why do they need to come back to it? What are you seeing what's been happening,

Dr. Cat Meyer 2:32  
many of us have a challenging relationship with our bodies, whether it's, you know, from these past experiences, these negative experiences, these messages that we inherited from our parents around our looks, or how our body is supposed to be, or our worth, how our worth is attached to what we can accomplish, what we can control what we can make happen or force happen. And even experiences around, you know, sexuality, or our body, our expression in our body, or the erotic connection, or the affection or the touch of it, or the inner sensuality of it all, the pleasure of it all, like we're tied up, we're a compilation of all these different programs and messages that we've experienced. And that can leave us with this complicated relationship, whether it's we don't want to look at our bodies because we cringe or we inhibit our expression because we want to protect against the potential harm or pain of rejection, or there may be a lot of fear residing on our body, a lot of anxiety in our body, a lot of just comfort or depression, depression is an experience of us suppressing an authentic expression in our body in order to, you know, create protection for ourselves. And so all of that exists in the body. And, if we don't want to, if we're trying to protect ourselves from that discomfort, then we're going to find these very clever ways to avoid being in the body. So whether we're distracting or we're avoiding, we're using food as a way to manage the feelings in our body, or we're focusing externally on other people and other things outside of the physical sensations of the body. Or we stay in our head and the very, you know, quote-unquote safe place it is to be in this intellectual space and analyzing everything rather than feeling Yeah. So it's about giving us these practices of how we can turn inward and face off with these, the complex layers of ourselves, you know, whether it's the psyche, the mental aspects of it, the emotional, the physical manifestations of that, and even the meaning that we ascribe to all these pieces, our body, our sex, our love, our worth, for us to be able to find more freedom and liberation in the body and then as a result, you know the longevity and vibrance See, which can only come if we're learning how to process some of these distressing past experiences or be able to process what our nervous system is trying to manage on a constant level, you know, whether it's fear or whether it's protection or otherwise.

Claudia von Boeselager 5:16  
And all the trauma that gets stored, right? I mean, it's from a guide. Yeah. People think that, Oh, I've, you know, I've suppressed the trauma, I don't, it doesn't affect me anymore. And when I hear that, it's always a bit of a flag and says, you know, what have you done to work through the trauma, and it's down there, and its trauma always comes back. And so I think, by ignoring it, it's just, it's going to manifest in certain ways. I mean, I used to be very well-versed and had a facade, and everything was fine. And you know, the house could be burning down behind me, and it's fine. And then emotions are suppressed, and physical and health issues tend to arise as well. So finding different ways to work through trauma is so important. I love your practice and what you're doing. So I'm excited to dig in.

Dr. Cat Meyer 6:01  
Absolutely. I mean, I used to struggle with a lot of autoimmune issues, alopecia, and foggy brain and stomach issues. And I couldn't understand why I was having all these issues. Because I was a yoga teacher, I was healthy, ate healthy exercise. But it was, it was all these sexual trauma pieces that weren't, again, I was doing the same thing I was suppressing. I was like, let's just focus on the positive; let's just, you know,

Claudia von Boeselager 6:28  
like, move forward, right? Just put the smile on; it's fine. But we don't understand

Dr. Cat Meyer 6:33  
that the nervous system is still running on high with that because it's, it's picking up cues in the environment and labeling it as dangerous. And so I didn't even realize I wasn't even physically connected to the fact that I was in a heightened nervous system state all the time. So, of course, that's going to exhaust me, and of course, it's going to bring up these, these physiological manifestations because in illnesses because you're not meant to be in this fear state.

Claudia von Boeselager 7:07  
Flight slides, exactly. And the problem is that the longer we run at that level, that we just, that's becomes the new baseline, and we think we're fine. And then we think that that's normal. And then this is where the chronic conditions come through, right?

Dr. Cat Meyer 7:19  
And it's easy to hide that in this Western culture where we're so fixated on, you know, lots of coffee and producing more and go go go go go, I didn't have to pay attention to that is affecting me. I was just like, you know, like, let's accomplish this and finish this and take on this, you know, it's like, whoa, busy, busy. Yeah, is this anxiety from unprocessed trauma causing anxiety from all this, like going going going? Like, it's the same heightened nervous system stayed the same cortisol running the same, like adrenaline, you know, so it's easy to mask

Claudia von Boeselager 7:55  
100% What was for you the real pivoting point?

Dr. Cat Meyer 7:59  
So I got really sick, and I also had zero sexual desire, zero sexual desires, zero. I struggled with relationships, I would last in relationships for about two weeks, and then I would be in a full-blown panic and in them very just abruptly. And so, like, after a while of experiences is like, you know, I'm studying sexuality. And I want that so much, but like, I, what's manifesting in my life is not that, and so I dove into studying all of this around, yeah, I started the physical and the academic route, and I wanted to learn as much as I could, you know, in research, but then I discovered more like Eastern philosophy and esoteric practices and energy and discover that healing happens on many levels. It's not just this mental and emotional or physical health, it's like, it's everything and then specializing more in trauma and doing my own trauma therapy work and, and also psychedelics and discount, you know, having these realizations come up from an experiential level of realizing No, I'm not in my body. Oh, that's what it means to surrender. Oh, I've been clenching in my body the entire time, every day. That's why I have pain. Oh, drop. Oh, yeah. So it's been, you know, it's been a progression over these last 15 years. But it's made it more of a holistic understanding by studying all these different perspectives and putting myself in these in these situations.

Claudia von Boeselager 9:37  
And that's what really makes a transformation right versus this that little scratching the surface. So what, in your view, is the importance of sex and sexuality for health, healthy living, and longevity?

Dr. Cat Meyer 9:50  
Yeah, and I think this comes back to exactly what I was saying. It's like, our sexuality is so tied up with our energy and our vibrancy. So The health of our nervous system helps us to be able to have a healthy sex life. But also the sex life can also support the health of our nervous system. So we do see, on a physiological level, this helps our immune system function. This helps our nervous system this helps us manage stress on the relational level; this helps us to be able to deepen and nourish the relationships that we have with other people. You know, this helps us to be able to feel close with somebody and to be able to, Yeah, that connectedness, but also, I really, I love to emphasize to my students around this concept of erotic intelligence around, you know, the more that we can infuse sexuality, not even just as the act of sex, but a living in our eroticism. eroticism is how we transform the way that we embody this, this sexual body with playfulness, or with creativity and imagination and, and we engage that same concept with everything around us, you know, our environment, or our coffee in the morning, or, or our, the, I don't know what's in my environment right now. I've got candles, like, really being in the pleasure of everything really helps us to, I guess, in turn, in coming full circle helps us to be able to strengthen that nervous system, which we know is what helps us to maintain vibrancy in our life like longevity needs us to feel like a relaxed in the body, it needs to allow this energy to flow through us it needs us to feel alive. And so pleasure actually helps us to strengthen that parasympathetic aspect of our nervous system, the rest part of our nervous system, so that we can feel more alive or feel more turned on or aroused.

Claudia von Boeselager 12:02  
And also present and centered, right? And there are so many beautiful hormones that are released, right? That help with, obviously, longevity, but good health as well. What are some of the best ways people maybe are struggling with their sexual health? And I know that there's a plethora of issues that people can have. But what are some things that you typically see if someone comes to you and says, you know, my either struggling with my sex life, or there are some issues that I have? What are some strategies that you recommend people look at first to improve their sexual health?

Dr. Cat Meyer 12:37  
Yeah, the very first thing that I do is to bring them into more of this mindset of living a pleasant life. Because sex is not just live in its own vacuum, it literally infuses and affects everything around us. So if we can treat our every day in more of a mindset of making decisions based on a place of pleasure, based not from a productive standpoint, which that's important to our logical standpoint, very important, but also to include what feels good for me, that helps us to be able to strengthen the capacity of the nervous system to hold higher states of energy flowing through it. So, from the somatic standpoint, we need to learn how to self-regulate the nervous system, which means calming the nervous system down so that it can hold more energy. The reason why individuals come into me and have trouble with maintaining erections is they have a difficult time with orgasm or with premature ejaculation these signs tell me that the individual has a difficult time holding higher states of energy coursing through their body. Many of these individuals have been having become accustomed to the, you know, more of a free state of their nervous system. So you've heard a fight-flight or freeze or a fawning is another form of it, of the freeze response. But if we stay in a state of frozenness, rather than being able to, to embody more of our bigness, more of our, you know, like, I like to use the word big cat energy, you know, like this more ferocity, then of course, we're going to shut down of course, our coffee is going to go and fall flat. Of course, we're not going to be able to orgasm we're going to clench up right as we're approaching that orgasm because we can't sustain high levels of stimulation. So pleasure and really focusing on savory nonpleasure in somatic therapy, which we call this glimmers and glows. So glimmer is the recognition of the fleeting recognition of something in our environment that feels good and opens the body. So like, in my office, I have these trees surrounding, and there's a bunch of little birds, so when I catch the birds, it really brings an expansion in my usually my in my chest, and my stomach is where I feel emotion the most. And then, if I stay focused on that, I'll notice a response in my body. That's a downregulating nervous system response. So either I'll sit back into my chair, or yawn, all SCI, I'll have a smile come up. And every time we do that, it strengthens the nervous system more and more and more. So making decisions based on pleasure, focusing on glimmers and glows, and allowing yourself to even get curious about your desires. It's such a vulnerable thing, but it's so important. You know, are we having the sex life that we think we're supposed to have, quote, unquote? Or are we having the sex life that we're supposed to want? Or that we want, that we desire that actually resonates with us? And it comes back to, you know, recognizing somatically how that desire shows up for us. That's the relationship. Yeah.

Claudia von Boeselager 16:01  
Beautifully said. And I think what I heard before a conversation, I was asking around, speaking with some friends, and also trying to get some feedback and questions. And I think for some people, what I hear is like, you know, life is so busy, and you're just doing doing doing and like, how are you supposed to have time and some people are in, you know, longer marriages and things like that as well. Like, how do you reconnect with that desire? If a lot of people feel like, oh, that part of me is kind of half shutdown? Or I'm not really connected to it. So how do you help people who feel that maybe they've neglected that part of themselves for so long that they don't know what to look out for, how to reawaken it, what you

Dr. Cat Meyer 16:39  
tapping into your curiosity? So your curiosity expands you; it opens you up; certainty is the death of growth. So we really need to tap into the curiosity, the potential what, what do I light up to or be drawn to? And so many people shortcircuit with the question, what do you want? Because it's a very loaded question. And, and that's a very vulnerable, you know, is my answer going to risk the loss of view is my answer going to cause conflict with you? So I always suggest to people fill their environment with erotic cues, or whether that is, you know, podcasts, or Instagram accounts, or erotic poetry, erotic literature, erotic stories, you know, follow these little threads that you come across and go down that, if it's interesting to you, so your curious interest will expand, you follow that don't follow down something that you feel you're supposed to go down, simply because, you know, I said, so. But we all have different erotic languages, so to say like my body is drawn to and turned on and really satiated by very specific cues. And then somebody else will have very other specific cues. And so when we look at this in relationships, if we recognize that we are two separate individuals with separate needs, desires, turn-ons, and even breaks that turn us off, then we can individuate, and it becomes way easier to work through some of these challenges, we're not putting that on the other person to make us orgasm or to know what to do, because they may speak a totally different language than we do. So maybe one of us is more sensual and needs like a lot of foreplay and warm up and, and ambiance, and maybe the other person is kinkier, you know, or into more BDSM or bondage or, or like whole productions of scenes. You know, or maybe one of us is more energetic and highly sensitive and needs more anticipation and teasing and lightness and the touch. And maybe the other person is just like, ready to stick it in and get an orgasm and let's go, you know, so when we can pause and recognize we are going to be different than our partner. That doesn't mean that we're sexually incompatible; it actually means that we can learn how to speak a new language and add to our repertoire. And it also means that we can infuse our needs with their needs; they don't have to be mutually exclusive, and they don't have to be conflicting. There is a way that we can interweave these, it's just gonna take conscious attention and work in order to do that. I think we fall under this there's this myth that sex needs to be natural or chemistry needs to be natural, and I just don't believe in that. I think that's the lazy way of doing it. But you know, it will be like anything we can if we put our intention around it, and we really cultivate this. Then we can get all I'll find resonance sexually with our partner.

Claudia von Boeselager 20:03  
Beautiful. And for some people to reconnect to that. Are there certain questions that you think or recommend that are good to sort of ask or to start with? I mean, I love the curiosity piece. But are there any certain questions you say are really great to show up as respect, you know, partner and say, you know, this is what my needs are? And I've sort of done my own self-discovery and what, you know, what can I do to pleasure you as well, there are certain things that you recommend.

Dr. Cat Meyer 20:30  
Yeah, anytime we're having a conversation with our partner, I think one of the reasons why we don't is because we're afraid that they're going to feel that we're going to hurt their feelings, or they're going to feel like they're, they're going to translate to me and that they're a bad lover. And so always starting these conversations with some form of, first of all, consent that we're going to go into this conversation. So would love to have a conversation around it and expand exploring our sex life and making it really as juicy as possible. Would you be open to that? Or when can we dive into that? That way, both people are consenting to a conversation like this, and we're not surprising somebody while they're getting ready for work and being like, I bet I want to talk about our sex life. And I'm really not gonna land very well, these are. These are my needs, I wrote a list. Yeah. And then starting out with appreciation. You know, we all want to be seen; we all want to be appreciated for our efforts. And we are all making efforts. And so if we can acknowledge the types of touch that they're doing that we love, one thing that I appreciate about you as my lover is, and follow that up with Yeah, a touch, or a look or the way they hold you or a position or a presence, that they give you an attunement, they give you whatever it is, give them that and in both of you share that, and then you can even go into one thing that I need more of or one thing that I'm curious about exploring or, or trying out or playing with, I love the wordplay. Because it connotates this exploration and experimentation without having to be good at it. There isn't it's played isn't attached to our worth; it's not attached to an end goal or result. It's we're going into something or trying it out. And on the other side, we decide whether that is something that we want to keep doing or not, and then even then, sharing with our partner on the spectrum of curiosity to reality, where does that curiosity fall? You know, is it something that just wants to stay in Fantasyland, and we talk about the fantasy of having a threesome? Or is this something that we actually want to do? And because it is sometimes something in fantasy, we don't actually want to bring into real life. But if we told our partner that we have a curiosity, I have a threesome, they might freak out and be like, you want to actually do that, you know, and that may not be the case. There are a lot of steps leading up to that first.

Claudia von Boeselager 23:12  
What are the biggest myths you mentioned before? But what are the biggest myths about sex and health you've encountered?

Dr. Cat Meyer 23:21  
Yeah, probably the biggest one is that successful sex, or good sex, is measured by having an orgasm. And I just, I don't subscribe to that. I think there's a lot of overemphasis on orgasm. I love orgasms. I love orgasms. Like don't get me wrong, I love them. But right, right, right. But we can put pressure on ourselves to experience an orgasm every time we engage in sex. And then that can turn a very enjoyable sexual interaction into work. So me and my partner, we're constantly having sex, like living in sex, not because we're having penetrative sex, and orgasm every five minutes or not, but it's a constant like grabbing each other and like breathing and moving energy and touching and sometimes we have insertion, and we're just rocking and rolling in with each other, and that's like five minutes. And then we're like, okay, okay, goodbye. I gotta go, you know? Yeah, we are constantly bumping into each other and grinding into each other. And then that's it. But it's like, that is sex as well. But it's almost like we've narrowed the definition of sex into this very tiny image of this behavior that we do in bed at this particular time, and it has to have this whole production and doesn't, you know, quickies can be, and quickies again don't have to have an orgasm. There are some fun interactions I've done with partners, and then I prescribe this to students as well of like, sometimes, you know, setting a timer for two minutes, or telling your partner, you have three minutes left to do this, to do this thing. And then at the end of that, it's it, that's it. But the, you know, you create a container, oftentimes for this, this wild energy just coursing through this vibrancy like, yeah, because you have a time limit, you got to get it in there, whatever it is enjoyed as much as you can squeeze it out, you know, squeeze out as much as you can from that experience. And, like, if you press yourself that I have to have an orgasm, and that, then that can totally deplete us and put us into performance anxiety, or I have to maintain an erection during those three months. No, you don't have to switch allow sex to be more of this breathing model versus this linear destination-oriented model. And that's where, again, as we think about, vibrancy can occur with that, you know, like, sex hormones support the production of sex hormones. Stress supports the production of stress hormones. So where, how much, are we paying attention? Where are we putting this attention? And that's going to help us to, you know, the feedback loop of creating more and more and more of that thing?

Claudia von Boeselager 26:24  
So would you say that it's as soon as you start getting goal orientated that it goes into the head? And actually, the key to pleasure is to stay in the body.

Dr. Cat Meyer 26:35  
Absolutely, yeah. And if you do get stuck in the head, or if you notice your partner get stuck up there, pause. Now we try to override it because we're afraid of ruining the experience. But it ruins the experience. If you try to push yourself through. And you're not there. You're not really present. Yeah, I mean, some of the sexiest moments are when I've had partners stop me pause, like notice that my mind is elsewhere, and they stop, and they're like, Hey, what's going on inside your head, you know, and then, and then we get to pause, and I get to tune into it. And I get to shift the direction of what we're doing, or I end up bursting into tears because there's something emotional that I'm holding back that I don't even realize I'm holding back because I'm just trying to stay in this experience. And, and I would love to, you know, help people see that that's what deepening sexes like, to deepen with another person or person insects is to, to us, though, it'd be so present to the nuances, and the fluctuations and the, the emotions and the mental distractions, and all of this is potent information for us to pay attention to and unlock even more of us.

Claudia von Boeselager 28:03  
Yeah, that curiosity again, like, oh, what's coming up? Why is this coming up? As you said, the new person went to tears what was happening? And you didn't even notice? Right? Right, right, actually, to the physical experience. You talked before about the power of sexual energy. And I'd love to just touch on that I have a friend who's a tantric coach as well. And he's a big fan of this. But can you share with my audience more about the power of this powerful force of sexual energy?

Dr. Cat Meyer 28:28  
Yes. So from the tantric tradition, this is referring to more of the Kundalini energy. In the tantric tradition, we paint this image of the snake or two snakes that rise up our spine when we have unlocked this power surge of energy. And so physically, we can see this manifested by the spine undulating or the body going into shivers or trembling, uncontrollably, and voluntarily or voluntarily, we can reach these experiences with relaxing the body, you know, breathing, using sound, vibration, and even movement of the body to both down-regulate the nervous system, but then also simultaneously activate the energy so that it can flow through the body and so there's space in the body for it to flow. So then, physiologically, the Kundalini reference represents the health of that nervous system. So we see in Tantra, these two snakes that weave up the spine, and that's representative of the sympathetic nervous system and the parasympathetic nervous system. We need to have the health of both of those to support healthy sex life. You know, the parasympathetic is that rest and digestion aspect of us we need to relax because that opens the body for flow to occur. We can't flow if our bodies tense and contract or exhaust. Now the sympathetic system is all about the activation, the arousal this is this is where we get turned on. And that's in that can be powerful energy coursing through us. And if we are, if we're exhausted, if we are in a fear state, if we can't hold high stimulation, then again, that comes back to, you know, struggle with orgasms, erections, even lubrication, you know, some of these arousal physiological responses. And so we have to find that, that balance between Yeah, between both of those, of course, breath is going to help with regulating our nervous system, of course, movement is going to help to open the body. This is why my company is sex, I love yoga because yoga is such a powerful avenue for opening the body, strengthening the nervous system, and even our connection with the body.

Claudia von Boeselager 30:58  
Are there certain practices in yoga that you say, in particular, are the most powerful for the work that you do?

Dr. Cat Meyer 31:05  
I mean, everything yoga, so Yoga is an eight-limb path, which means that there's there are several different aspects of yoga; there is the pranayama, which is the breath, and the breath helps with, again, nervous system regulation to be able to calm us to open us but also to, to activate energy in our body. Then we have the asana practice, which is the physical body movements. So this is the stretching, the contouring, contorting the body, practicing imbalances. And, there's a lot of bilateral movement there, which helps with the brain regulation, the nervous system regulation, but it also helps to open the fascia, which is the connective tissue throughout the body, so that there is more of an open channel of energy and flow and feeling and helps to support our hormones. And then there are also lifestyle practices; the yamas and niyamas are our principles to live life, then there are also the meditative practices. And meditation helps us in sex to be able to focus on the person in front of us or focus on our own sensation, reduces distraction, and also helps alleviate so much of the built-up stress in our body. So I see all of these as benefiting our sex life and our love life. Yeah, I see. Absolutely, yeah. Yeah.

Claudia von Boeselager 32:35  
Let's talk about sex therapy. Some people might not be that familiar with, you know, what exactly is six-six therapy? What does it entail? What are some sort of use cases? Why do people come to you for sex therapy, and what can be resolved with it,

Dr. Cat Meyer 32:50  
people come to me for sex therapy for everything. Like, like, I don't know, I made this joke that I think everybody could benefit from a sex therapist or a sex coach. Because, again, we are wrapped up in so much cultural shame and programming and miseducation, even about how our bodies operate. And I went to a Catholic school in the Midwest of the United States, and it was all abstinence-only or reproduction focus; it was like the messages received of you can't masturbate. Masturbation is a sin, you know, don't have sex before marriage. That is foundational to my understanding of sex. And so, imagine how our bodies respond. You know, when we're approaching these situations, I have so many clients who have shame from their religious upbringing. And this isn't to knock religion. But there's just this is a really good example of how messages from somebody who's an authority figure that we look to for guidance and for helping us to understand how we're supposed to operate in the world. And at those formative ages, that becomes our reality. And so then, as we grow, we experience other situations where we then have to come up to like the body contracts, or we freeze, or our we have a difficult time with getting turned on, or we get so turned on, and then we feel shame for having all these sexual urges, you know, like, what do we do with this? Why does this feel good that I'm like, you know, rubbing my crotch against this, this chair, like, but I'm not supposed to do this, right? So we have to untangle a lot of that. And then I also have clients who come in with painful penetration, painful sex, sometimes sexual trauma and whether it's a violation or even just the fear that comes with for a woman walking down the street and having eyes leering at her, you know, that leaves that's left many of my clients feeling like they're unsafe. Being in the body that they are, their body is unsafe, they have to hide their body in order to protect themselves from harm. For many women in my courses, I teach breast massage, and there are tears; there are so many tears that happen because they don't touch their breasts. And there's a negative relationship with them, you know, maybe they were made fun of because they developed too soon, or maybe their boyfriend called them something terrible, or, you know, or maybe the mom's relationship with her own body influenced they're growing up. And so it's like, now we're touching them. And it's like, everything clenches, and memories come up. And it's such a precious, vulnerable moment, but it's also a physic somatic reprocessing of our stuff like we're showing up for our body, or being affection and, and present with our own body can be wild, and also helping women with their orgasms. You know, there are so many women who don't realize how their bodies function. And so they are either aren't experienced or are experiencing orgasm, or they are experiencing orgasm, but it's like very late, and they so they're like, I don't know if that's an orgasm, or if I'm just sneezing is helping them to know like, Okay, your body actually needs a lot of warm-ups, you know, you need about 30 to 45 minutes, and we pressure ourselves to be in five or 10 minutes. And that may not be where our body's at yet. Or maybe we need more clitoral stimulation rather than just penetration, or the body needs to be touched. And maybe we're tensing the pelvic floor. There are a lot of physiological and emotional reasons why we can be experiencing the symptoms that we are, and so unraveling that and having a safe place for people to talk about. It's like, can I talk about sex with somebody? Yeah, I don't know. It's scary it's.

Claudia von Boeselager 37:07  
And yet I feel like so many people want to know more and be curious. I mean, one of the people I've had on the podcast was John Grey, who's a relationship coach who was eight years a Buddhist monk. And then when he came out, and this is, I think it's just such a funny story, because when he came out, he was like, Okay, well, how do I do sex? Right? Like, he's like, I don't know anything about this. So he made it a point of researching and talking to people and asking a lot, and he became, quote, unquote, such an expert that people started going to him. And that's how he became a sex therapist and then went on to become a relationship therapist as well. So he really just kind of dug in and did his research around it. Curiosity. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And interest. And I guess, get a good story saying I was a monk. And now I have no idea what to do. So can you help me, please? But where I see a lot of women and just speaking to different people around, this is the confusion with orgasms. And why is that? So? I mean, I know you said there are a lot of cultural things behind it as well. But I feel like so many women feel either like it's not possible for them, or it's super difficult, or, you know, they push themselves don't like it shouldn't, you know, doesn't always happen to me, but that's okay. What do you recommend for women who are maybe struggling with understanding their own bodies around orgasm and different ways to attain that?

Dr. Cat Meyer 38:27  
Yeah, yeah. And so I want to start by, it is okay not to experience an orgasm. Like, I think there's over fixation on orgasm makes orgasm elusive. So if we relax the pursuit of it, and we allow our body to express itself the way that it needs to, and allow pleasure to be our compass, and go and shoot and follow where it feels good, then that is foundational for experiencing orgasm. But if we're fixated on I have to experience an orgasm, oftentimes, they hide from us.

Claudia von Boeselager 39:09  
Like those unicorns, they just keep running.

Dr. Cat Meyer 39:12  
Right? Exactly. So it's, it's so it's almost like we have to take our eyes off the direct focus of it for us to in order to experience it. But then also with that, it's, gosh, I take women through a process of, Yeah, identifying what these negative self-talk, where did that come from, you know, in the culture, and then teaching them about how to be present to their body and downregulating their nervous system while they're being present and pleasuring and touching the body. Because and, and putting these in bite-sized pieces of exercises, because a lot of women will be like, oh, you know, like, I masturbate, but I get bored, or I find myself getting distracted. And I'm like, Yeah, so maybe we need to do practices that are even smaller than that, you know, like shorter than that, set your timer for that. And if you don't experience an orgasm, and they're great, it's all contributing to the foundation of the RE conditioning of the body. I remember when I first brought myself to orgasm, in my 20s I was 23 When I first had sex, and then when I brought to orgasm, I was probably for the first time, I think I was like, 26 or so I had a lot of sexual trauma had to work through. And I would keep coming back to the practice and keep coming in, I would get so frustrated, I would legit get frustrated. And then, when I finally did, I was in this practice for 45 minutes before the orgasm decided to reveal itself. And I started crying out to that. You know, yeah. But again, it was this, you know, consistency, devotion, stopping when I was getting distracted, bringing myself back, Breathing, relaxing, and then you have the patience. Patience is really key. So it's balancing the layers of this, the mental, the emotional, the physical, even the spiritual, you know, what is? What does it mean for me to be with my body? What does it mean for me to have an orgasm? What does it mean for me to have to be in pleasure and make sure that those align with compassion and care for yourself versus

Claudia von Boeselager 41:39  
because it's like a form of self-love? Almost. Right? So reconnecting yourself and, you know, finding that love for yourself as well. And taking care of yourself? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Whenever your cover is around having insight from sexual intelligence. Why is this important? What exactly is it? And how can these insights be embodied?

Dr. Cat Meyer 41:59  
So erotic intelligence is the fusion of five different principles of the health of our social intelligence, which is how we interact with other people. Emotional Intelligence is how we attune to our own individual emotions, as well as the emotions of other people were able to read, read them accurately, read ourselves accurately, and create the space for our emotional experience, expression, body connection, body embodiment, you know, the connection of sensations of the body, openness of the body, expression of the body, and creativity. So creativity and imagination, how well are we infusing that playfulness or trying something different or adding more, more production, more fun to the activity versus just having sex or being playful and flirty, I love flirting; flirty, is a great, playful, creative way. And then also the inclusion of self-understanding. So the depth of how much you know yourself, self-awareness, self-connection with your thoughts, your beliefs, your behaviors, your patterns. So the more that we can cultivate these and nourish these, we'll see them in the product of, of vibrancy, you know, this, this heightened energy, this health, even this motivation to keep doing sex or to keep connecting or to keep playing in that sexual space of ourselves again, whether it's in the bedroom, or it's just in the way that we embody our sexual body and expression. Because if we're just subscribing to this, the sex of the culture, what the culture says, and we don't confuse that with creativity, or imagination, or if we're not connected to our body, or if we're not attuning to somebody's emotions and our own emotions, or if we're not taking the time to understand ourselves like that's not going to motivate us to be in this sexual space. And it's actually going to result in more depletion, sex as depletion, sex as boring, sex as not something that I'm motivated to do. It's a task, it's work, it's, it's like, oh, I don't have the energy for that tonight. Because of these things. And I always tease that if you hear from yourself or from your partner, like, I'm too tired and don't have the energy for sex the night, then you're subscribing to that socially constructed idea of sex. And one of these five is not being tended to. If you're too tired, have sex that's just like you and then like washing your faces together and just like holding each other and breathing like that. That's pleasurable, energy output

Claudia von Boeselager 44:56  
and pleasure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. Let's talk about sexual healing and psychedelics. Can you share more about your work on this?

Dr. Cat Meyer 45:09  
Yes. So personally, psychedelics were a part of my sexual healing path. And I think it's really important. I see so many coaches and practitioners out there who speak to self-development, and they have a background in psychedelics, but they don't tell you. And so I think I do think it's important to be open and honest about, you know, what's contributed to our path. I've had two years of therapy as well and so many other ways, but psychedelics were a big part of it Ayahuasca was my first introduction, and Oregon psilocybin was my first introduction, and then I Alaska and went into more ceremonial perspectives, and then getting into the clinical aspect of it. So using ketamine in therapy practices, couples therapy, and individual therapy. So psychedelics, each and every single one of them, have their own specific texture of experience and have their own way of addressing the physiology and the neurobiology to invoke these different experiences for us. So I can see how each of these can have its own way; these aren't their own lessons that we can access as reference points here in that psychedelic-induced state, and then we can learn how to integrate that into our everyday life. So there's a lot of research around MDMA for couples therapy, and why does MDMA help us with couples therapy? Well, because it helps us to be able to connect with emotion and process emotion in real-time. There, it's a pathogen, so it opens our hearts so we can be more vulnerable and we can be more positive receiving our partner. And from a compassionate and curious state versus a dysregulated or defensive state. We even see this with ketamine too. So in my practice, I've seen how individuals report, you know, being the pain and the heaviness of depression lifted so that they can work through what's underneath that trauma. And we've been able to go into some of these trauma pieces in a way that they can face off with some of the pain without the dysregulation that happens from the intense emotions of that moment. And so we can actually go in there and reprocess something. Same with MDMA. Those two are really powerful in working with trauma because of that particular experience. During my ketamine-assisted therapy training room full of doctors roomful of therapists, I had a full-blown energetic orgasm; wow. You know, experiencing an academy, and I came out of thought we were all processing, or everybody looks to me, and they're like, What happened to you? Sounds great. Let's do it again. I went in with the intention of how can I use this for sexual sex therapy. Like, is it possible to, because I've heard from so many people, so many people told me ketamine, it's a dissociate or so you're not going to be able to use it for sex therapy, or Yeah, it's there's nothing sexy about ketamine. But that's not the case that I've learned from myself from my clients from I even have a lot of ongoing surveys where I'm collecting people's anecdotal experiences. And there are several people, I have over 100 over 550 participants in that in that survey, and I've had several people say that ketamine helps them to be able to access pleasure where they typically have a lot of anxiety, or it helps them to feel deeper connection and love with their partner, and that they were able to put down their defenses, that they were able to feel the energy moving through their body in a way that they hadn't before in sex. So again, I think what it comes down to is how we are prepping. And how are we setting up the experience with these psychedelics or psychedelic therapy, you know, if we start with the intention of something related to sex, and then we use practices that help us, to connect with that part of us, then I think that they can really help us to, again, create that reference point of what's possible. And once we create a reference point of what's possible, it becomes easier for us to recreate that into a sober mindset. But that takes practice it takes practice It takes consistency and devotion. I think, you know, people will argue with me and say, Well, I can't feel experience a cosmic energetic orgasm. In a sober mindset, I can only have that in psilocybin and MDMA. And I would argue that I have very psychedelic sex without psychedelics. And a lot of that has come from my tantric background. And a lot of that has come from, you know, the sexual trauma work that I've done. And, you know, the devotion that I've put into that allows me to reach those states. But again, psychedelics helped me to realize I was not in my body, there was a lot of fear, there was a lot of clenching, there was a lot of, you know, even identifying where the exhaustion was coming from, it was made clear in that space of psychedelic, so,

Claudia von Boeselager 50:50  
so beautiful and so powerful, what can be done? I think it's such an exciting space, the research that's coming out, and I mean, across the board, but to be able to help heal also for sexual healing and sexual trauma as well. Would you say that different people, like different people, would respond to say psilocybin better versus MDMA versus ketamine? Do you see that? Or would you say, like, you know, ketamine is for everyone looking to experience sexual healing as well? Is it? Is it across the board? Or how would you reference it?

Dr. Cat Meyer 51:20  
Oh, my gosh, that's such a good question. I will never say that psychedelics are for everyone, ever. I don't believe that. I think that there can be an overemphasis on psychedelics as this panacea. And I disagree with that; I think is similar again, each of these has different textures. Each of these also has different again, physiological responses, and it's not physically or mentally appropriate for everyone. Ketamine happens to have the highest safety profile of all of these psychedelics, meaning that it's more appropriate. Healthwise, for more people. There are certain counter-indications, but ketamine has been around for over. I think it's been like 50 years. And originally it was used on the battlefield to help soldiers. It's also used there, right? Yeah, it's used in pediatrics. You know, it's used in and, yeah, as an anesthetic to, so more people can use that. The downside of that is it's also more highly addictive than the other psychedelics. So, you know, there are some considerations around that. Some considerations around certain mental health challenges, and then also, low blood pressure and heart conditions, MDMA is not appropriate for people with high blood pressure, you know, it's not appropriate for, but it's also appropriate for a lot of more trauma, it's excellent for working with trauma because it helps to quiet down the amygdala and the fear part of the brain so that we can work with some of these pieces. And then psilocybin isn't appropriate for everybody, for people on SSRIs, or, you know, with other tendencies or a family history of psychosis. And so, it ultimately, and there are more counter-indications there too I really want to encourage people to talk to their doctors, you know, what is the intention? What is it that we're going for? Because certain ones will help more effectively than others? But then also, what are what is your physical makeup? And what is your lifestyle and what's going on for you so that there can be one that's more appropriate for you to

Claudia von Boeselager 53:41  
and which patient profile, if you will, so people are listening in this thinking, Okay, I've kind of heard about psychedelics, I've never thought about psychedelics and sexual healing. Maybe this is for me; what are some questions you would typically ask a patient to see if this might be a good solution for them? First of

Dr. Cat Meyer 54:01  
all, I have to emphasize that, you know, I don't promote the illegal use of substances. All of this is for educational purposes. And we are seeing more and more rolling out, like legally across, you know, in the United States, but also in other parts of the world. The Netherlands and Jamaica are both two countries that have psilocybin and truffles available, legal. And so you can go to retreats there or work with therapists or practitioners, they're so you know, emphasizing that so as for the ketamine work that I do, I have them do a medical evaluation with their with the doctor that I work with who prescribes and then I do an evaluation of them in the first session and gather information about their mental health and then even what the particular issue is that they're struggling with. Because sometimes, you know, I have clients who come in and they want to work around the sexuality and in ketamine, and sometimes I'm like, actually, we can just deal with you, we can just do regular talk therapy, sex therapy, and I can give you these things, and we can work on that way. But then sometimes they come in, and I'm like, I think the Academy would be really helpful to help to alleviate some of this, that this symptom that you're experiencing, so we can work on the root of it. And it'll just, you know, fast-track the healing. Yeah, so I would say that. And then also, sometimes, I work with couples in the ketamine space, too. And so I find that to be really powerful when they can share the experience together.

Claudia von Boeselager 55:39  
So it's not only about being able to go deeper in terms of accessing different parts of, say, the mind and brain to relieve the trauma. But would you also say that the time period needed for the therapy, it's condensed because of the power of ketamine-assisted therapy?

Dr. Cat Meyer 55:58  
It can be; it certainly can be. But I also emphasize that it's up to the client, how much they how devotional they get about the integration. So we can have psychedelic experiences and get a lot of insights. But then, what are you doing to make sure that that stays in your life? That's the key; that's what we're psychedelic is just a tool. But this is a lifestyle change. So you, you get these golden nuggets like, Oh, like this is what Self Love feels like, Okay, now, we have to, you know, we can go back to what was programmed in us that's homeostasis, which is self-loathing, or we can every day or every week, do something that's really loving for ourselves or affectionate or caring. And that's what's going to change the neuro wiring for us. Not the aha moment.

Claudia von Boeselager 56:53  
I guess that's part of the journey. Right? And so you support then, I guess patients also with the integration process have really become rewiring those neural pathways, as you say, and embodying that. Is that part of your Oh, yeah? Yeah. Yeah, super important. The doctor kept my listeners interested in following what you're doing and learning more about sex and yoga, love, and all this amazing work you're doing what is the best way that they can follow what you're doing?

Dr. Cat Meyer 57:22  
Yeah, so they can find me on Instagram at sex, love yoga; they can also find me on my website, sexloveyoga.com. I have a podcast, sex, and I love psychedelics. And I also have a book called Sex love yoga, which is all psychological themes around those three concepts, but in a poetic framework to really help you feel and feel, feel validated, feel held, and give you an emotional hug.

Claudia von Boeselager 57:46  
Beautiful, and we'll link all of those in the show notes. Do you have a final ask recommendation or any parting thoughts or messages for my audience today?

Dr. Cat Meyer 57:55  
I would remind people that your sex life is infinite; the potential of it is infinite. As long as you stay curious,

Claudia von Boeselager 58:03  
beautiful, thank you so much for coming on today. This has been such a pleasure in many ways and so insightful; it was great, and I would love to have you back at one point for round two.

Dr. Cat Meyer 58:13  
Thank you so much. Thank you.