Transcript
Claudia [00:00:00]:
My guest today is doctor Jeffrey Gross. Doctor Jeffrey is an accomplished medical professional graduating from UC Berkeley in biochemistry and molecular cell biology with a doctor of medicine from George Washington University. He specialized in neurological surgery contributing to virology research. Since 2020, he has been acknowledged as a top doctor and received HealthTap's 2020 2 top doctor award. He's the founder of Recelebrate and emphasizes antiaging regenerative medicine, prioritizing modern biochemical treatments over surgery. Doctor Gross is a leading figure in advancing neurological surgery and holistic healthcare practices. Welcome to the longevity lifestyle podcast. Doctor Gross, it's such a pleasure to have you on again.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:00:48]:
Thank you. The pleasure's mine.

Claudia [00:00:50]:
I'm so excited to dive into this topic. As you were we were just mentioning before, we've had doctor Harry Adelson on. He's also in the stem cell space, and I think it's just such an important topic for people to better understand the modalities and what's available. And I think where I'd love to start is to understand where did your passion for stem cells come from?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:01:11]:
Thank you. So I I was practicing and still am to some degree some traditional medicine. I'm a neurosurgeon by training. I I have a spine fellowship. The vast majority of my practice is taking care of people with neck and back problems, from decades now.

Claudia [00:01:29]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:01:30]:
Applying traditional treatment, modalities and options. And it was my patients who sort of, keep, you know, pounding me with the idea of, you know, stem cells. But what happened is I would see many patients, give them advice, and walk them through the path of treatment from therapies to injections. And then when those things failed and they still had problems of significance, we would start to talk about the option of surgery, unless there was something, of course, urgent that needed surgery, which isn't that common in the office setting. And in in in those patients, my menu didn't have anything else on it. It had therapy injections. And then if that didn't work, well, let's talk surgery. But so many patients were smart enough to say, yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:02:23]:
I'm just not ready for surgery even though I'm still hurting. Even though the other treatments were inadequate. So they would say, how about lasers? How about, you know, this? How about that? How about stem cells? And you hear stem cells enough. And, of course, I do have the undergraduate background in that. Mhmm. And a lot had happened in the 30 plus years since my undergraduate training. Mhmm. So I finally, you know, woke up and said, I'm going to go get retrained and add this tool to my toolbox.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:02:55]:
Mhmm. And, it has blossomed more than I could have ever imagined now because I I I do probably 75, 80% regenerative medicine and all its ramifications now, without thinking I would. I I got into it to add to my tools and really it's my main tool now. Thinking about it. Proud to say I re I have a great new tool to help many patients avoid surgery. Not all patients. I mean, there still is a role for surgery, but, surgery is probably overused in the community. So I'm happy to you know, reducing its utility.

Claudia [00:03:39]:
Yeah. No. Thank you for sharing that. And so that's obviously an astounding number. Right? 75 to 80% of your practice is now focused on this regenerative medicine piece. Why is that? What's happening? What are you seeing that has made a takeover from all the different modalities and tools that you've had?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:03:57]:
Well, a few things. 1st, efficacy. I'm I'm quite surprised sometimes at the at the results that we get. That that's not a guarantee that everyone is cured by it, but it I continue to be amazed on a daily basis. So I I feel this renewed sense of sort of scientific pursuit and enjoyment in in treating new things and different things that I compared to my prior practice. Mhmm. And, it's it's much less invasive. The risks are minimal, if any, compared to surgery.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:04:34]:
And, you know, cost effectiveness is there. You know, the cost of surgery, the downtime for surgery, the pain of surgery, all that, the missed work and and what have you. I mean, a a regenerative injection is minimal compared to that.

Claudia [00:04:54]:
So maybe you can explain a few, like, use cases for people listening who are kind of you know, they're like, I've heard of it. I don't really understand it. When is stem cells really beneficial? Like, have you seen amongst your patient body? And maybe you can, you know, explain some before and after. Sure. Walk us through a few examples.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:05:13]:
Sure. Thank you. I I think I caught the low hanging fruit or some of our best cases are weight bearing joints like the knees. And the knees are common problems. And even though I I didn't often treat knees, I would refer those to knee surgeons in my career. I treat them now. So, we're looking for people who have what's called arthritis, vaguely. It's probably a poorly used term.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:05:42]:
But it generally means inflammation of the joint. And usually it's a painful inflammation. Mhmm. Sometimes more aptly called osteoarthritis. The other form of arthritis is is a disease process called rheumatoid arthritis, but those patients can also benefit. And, sometimes the doctor might call this bone on bone condition where the cartilage wears away. Mhmm. The fancy term is chondromalacia.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:06:11]:
Mhmm. Wearing away of the cartilage layers, the the the squishy stuff in between all the bones and in in our body. Mhmm. Well, when those wear down and cause pain, you know, the an orthopedic doctor might offer you cortisone injections, physical therapy, and then eventually joint replacement surgery, which is pretty big deal still. So, we we take patients like that. We do proper imaging, and that that requires some some precision, MRI sequences and things. Mhmm. And, we do some targeting based on what we see in the joint and near the joint.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:06:48]:
Mhmm. Mhmm. And, we inject the regenerative biologics to the subchondral bone. And that means the bone Mhmm. Just above and below the joint space, just adjacent to the cartilage. Mhmm. Because one of the best banks of our own stem cells, are the cells in the growth plates in the bone marrow. So even though those growth plates have closed, there's still a bank of stem cells there.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:07:18]:
Mhmm. And, sometimes they just need a little kick in the pants. And that, we hope help to reawaken those. And those are the cells that help produce the cartilage that makes the surface of of the joint, what's called the articular surface. Mhmm. And and because there aren't a lot of cells in the joint, in the cartilage itself. Cartilage is sort of biological rubber. And, for most of the research done in the last couple decades, stem cells or other biologics were injected into the joint space.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:07:53]:
Mhmm. And there are some good results, some not so good results. Mhmm. Recent publication from Emory University, looked back at all the studies of joint injections. I think it was limited to the knee and have to go back Mhmm. And found that it was not a better outcome than surgery. Mhmm. But, I follow the protocol of a French orthopedic doctor named Philippe Hernigault, and, I probably mispronounced his name.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:08:21]:
I'm sorry, professor, but, I, he has published now over 15 year follow-up on injecting the subchondral bone of the joint compared to the in the joint. He had both groups in his study. And he has found significant long term benefit in the bone injected group compared to the joint injected group.

Claudia [00:08:45]:
Oh, wow. Why do you think

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:08:46]:
that was? Yeah. So I follow that protocol. We inject the bone, or we call that intraosseous injection. And we are seeing results with with within the earliest we have, I think, is a 9 month follow-up MRI. We don't always get MRIs after, but some people are super curious. So we we do an MRI. We have seen enhancement of the cartilage layer, by thickening the cartilage, return of some of the cartilage protein thickness.

Claudia [00:09:17]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:09:17]:
And with it, the moisture content that helps that cartilage be a cushion again. So and with that, we've seen the clinical benefits. So we we've been very happy. I think knees do the best because they have a lot of surface area, sort of a a lot of, you know, contact area.

Claudia [00:09:34]:
Yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:09:35]:
Ball and socket joints tend to take a little longer, and I think non weight bearing joints like the shoulder Mhmm. Takes even a little bit longer.

Claudia [00:09:43]:
Mhmm. Why do you think there's such a significant difference with injecting into the bone? Do you think because it's really reactivating the own, stem cell bank you were saying that that's in the bone area?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:09:54]:
I think I think that's the main reason. You're right. I think that that and I've said this before. I I think it's cute. The party is in the bone. That's where the biology is.

Claudia [00:10:05]:
Uh-huh.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:10:05]:
That's that's where the activity is. That's where the cells are. There's there are very few cells in the joint space in the cartilage. The cartilage is sort of an appendage of the joint, if you will. Mhmm. And if you think about it, we we have follicles cells in our scalp that make hair. The hair is not a cell. It's a protein extension of the cell.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:10:26]:
Mhmm.

Claudia [00:10:26]:
And,

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:10:28]:
the, the same happens with the cartilage. It is sort of this protein byproduct of the local cells that that make the those proteins. So, we need to go to the source, the factory of those cell those proteins rather, and that is the bone marrow and particularly the stem cells in that bone marrow, regular cells too, at end stage or differentiated cells, but also the stem cells which have the most potential to reanimate. And that's really what we're tapping into.

Claudia [00:11:01]:
That's really exciting. And would you say it's for patients of any age, or are there any sort of knockout criteria after a certain point? It's not gonna have the same results. What are you seeing?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:11:12]:
I'm seeing that we we haven't restricted anyone by age. We we tend to get the best results in people who are less inflamed, so we like to optimize patients first. Meaning, you know, let's talk about your diet and your sleep and your breathing and your, supplements and things around you. Like, what's your water source? What's you know, is there bad bad things in your neighborhood, in your air? And and and if you have a disease of inflammation, like an autoimmune disease or something, we want to help address that first because if we're going to do one of these procedures, we we want to stack the deck in your favor for success. So I think that the more inflamed and and the inflammation of a joint causes the degeneration of the joints. So Mhmm. To reverse that, to go from degeneration to regeneration, we need to knock out as much inflammatory cell activity that we can. So we we wanna do that holistically and comprehensively.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:12:16]:
And, therefore, sometimes we have a fairly healthy octogenarian that can do well with the procedure. And I also have young people who might not, behave, in lifestyle choices very well and not do as well.

Claudia [00:12:33]:
Uh-huh.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:12:33]:
So we the only contraindications or reasons we wouldn't do the procedure was, you know, if you're on a blood thinner that you cannot come off of temporarily. Mhmm. Because it's a needle based procedure, you you know, we can't do that. Mhmm. That's really the the main thing.

Claudia [00:12:50]:
Mhmm. And in terms of you said you do the MRI scan, and then people just come into the clinic. There's the injection, and then they're walking out of there the same day. Is there what's the recovery periods?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:13:01]:
Yeah. So when we do the this type of work, because it's in the bone, it it you do feel it. So we do these actually at an injection facility. Mhmm. And there is sedation involved, not general anesthesia. Mhmm. And, you know, it takes me anywhere from, you know, 15 to 30 minutes to do, you know, a joint. I I'm very precise.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:13:23]:
We use fluoroscopy, which is an X-ray guidance based on the MRI so I can target. I do a lot of work ahead of time Mhmm. Measuring out. So we we, you know, give them a band aid and a hug and send them on their way. And we want them using those joints because the the physical use of the joint stimulates, sensory endings in the joint called mechanoreceptors. Mhmm. And it it basically tells the local cellular activity, hey. This is an area where I need help.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:14:07]:
I I need to withstand stress here. And, those cell receptors come up and and the activity and the protein production can focus in those areas. So we we don't really have downtime. We don't want downtime after this. So that's wonderful right there.

Claudia [00:14:24]:
Yeah. It's really it's really wonderful. Because years ago, I had keyhole surgery for meniscus. And, I mean, I had one week. I was told, you know, to have crutches, to not use it. And already, I mean, I was early twenties at the time, but, I could see within one week the muscle degeneration that happens. It's so incredible how quickly that goes. And so if you can not have any downtime and just continue, you don't have that whole long recovery period as well.

Claudia [00:14:47]:
So it's it's really exciting. And can you talk about the type of stem cells? I know that, people are always like, you know, is this from a baby? Where are you getting them? Can you can you Yes.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:14:59]:
Well, you you did a a wonderful job of going over that in a recent podcast, and I don't I don't want to completely reeducate your audience. But, I've I've really moved beyond stem cells, and I'm using almost a 100% now, stem cell derived exosomes or cell signaling nanoparticles. Mhmm. And as you know, these are the small and, of course, cells are already small, but these are even smaller. Nano. Nano. Right? Cell like, particles that a stem cell drives. All cells make these extracellular vesicles for acute.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:15:38]:
We call them exosomes, e x o s o m e s. Mhmm. And those exosomes are not cells, but they do have little membrane like a cell. And in them, they have instructions, communication from one cell to another to program into more of an anti inflammatory mode, which is a healing restorative regenerative mode. Mhmm. As opposed to our typical defense pro inflammatory mode, which degenerates us. Right? It causes disease and causes us to age. In fact, many believe, and I I think I'm in that camp that that really this chronic inflammation is aging ourselves and aging us.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:16:17]:
And and to age slower, you need to slow or even reverse that inflammation.

Claudia [00:16:22]:
Yes.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:16:22]:
Right? Mhmm. So, so I'm using almost exclusively, these stem cell derived exosomes from perinatal source. Mhmm. I don't source biologics. We call these regenerative biologics. I don't source biologics from Mhmm. The same person, because when I take my car to have the oil change, I don't put the old oil back in. Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:16:47]:
So, I want the the best, freshest, most youthful, most active

Claudia [00:16:53]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:16:54]:
Material that has been unexposed to the pro inflammatory stresses in our world.

Claudia [00:17:04]:
Exactly. I'd love to. I heard recently about, like, a drinkable version of stem cells as well. Are you familiar with that? Have you used

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:17:13]:
that? I I'm not. You know, stem cells struggle to pass through certain areas. So cells don't pass through our gastrointestinal tract well. Mhmm. They don't get through the skin well. Mhmm. They don't get even if you have them intravenous

Claudia [00:17:34]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:17:34]:
They do not even get into the nervous system well because they do they're too large really to cross into the blood brain barrier. Mhmm. Mhmm. So stem cells really we look at these as a delivery vehicle for the most part. Mhmm. And, although they were very exciting a few years ago and still in some areas, it turns out that these exosomes are really doing most of the work. That's the medicine, if you will. Mhmm.

Claudia [00:18:01]:
So that's why you've mainly you said focus on the exosomes.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:18:05]:
That that's one of a list of reasons why I mainly focus on them. The others, if you allow are, they are easier to handle Mhmm. In terms of the freezer. They only need to be kept at minus 30 c instead of minus 80 c for cells. Mhmm. They're less likely to break and and we call lice or or rupture. Mhmm. Probably having to do with size and stability.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:18:34]:
They are, more abundantly concentrated. I can get a more concentrated dose. Mhmm. And, they travel further in the tissue if you want that dispersion, particularly IV or stem cells. If you do IV tend to get hung up in the heart and lungs to some degree. Mhmm. Great for the heart and lungs, but the rest of the body, you know, is still thirsty. At the back.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:18:58]:
And maybe the largest benefit, particularly these days, is they're about half the price of a dose of stem cells.

Claudia [00:19:05]:
Mhmm. Which is which is pretty huge as well.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:19:07]:
Yeah.

Claudia [00:19:08]:
What do you find most exciting about regenerative medicine and what you see in the advancements?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:19:24]:
Cautiously looking at sort of enhanced or designer exosomes. There are already some publications on designer exosomes for production of collagen for cosmetic purposes. Mhmm. There are, exosomes that can be we'll call them stuffed with mitochondria

Claudia [00:19:43]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:19:43]:
To deliver mitochondria in what's called mitochondrial transfer therapy to help, let's say, aging patients who are losing muscle mass.

Claudia [00:19:52]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:19:53]:
You know? And, many diseases deal with poorly functioning or loss of volume of mitochondria, and then cells tend to move into senescence or zombie phase if you don't take care of them. Yeah. There are some immune cell exosomes that seem to have some benefits in early studies against hard to treat cancers. So we've got some really cool projects to hopefully patch some areas in medicine where we're not succeeding right now. Mhmm.

Claudia [00:20:27]:
I think it's it's, really fascinating what is possible, and I think we're at the cusp of you know, I think with the advances of technology to support the research, it just expedites things tremendously. Right?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:20:40]:
Yeah.

Claudia [00:20:41]:
And I think, you know, people being brave and trying different things as well. But I I it really sounds phenomenal. What would you say for naysayers? People who are saying, well, my doctor said I have to have surgery. There's no other way. How should they help to have a better dialogue with their surgeon to explore looking at alternative modalities, for example, like stem cells?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:21:07]:
Well, I I wanna answer this cautiously because I never wanna talk anyone into anything. And and the people that seek this type of of treatment already have an idea of it or have heard of it or even just the buzzword stem cells, even though we're using mainly exosomes, they are stem cell derived. But I I would say this, and I would say this even before I went into regenerative medicine as an adjunct to my practice

Claudia [00:21:34]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:21:34]:
Is, you know, before having surgery, make sure you've looked at every option and have multiple opinions from doctors of diverse backgrounds and maybe diverse ages. Because it occurred to me when I was deciding to make the flip to add this, you know, new area of medicine to my practice. Mhmm. That what I did as a spine surgeon and what most of the spine surgeons do, has been done for 50, 60 years. Hasn't changed drastically.

Claudia [00:22:07]:
Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:22:08]:
You know? We have 2 main surgeries. We either open up the spine to make more room somehow or we fuse the spine, which is somewhat, you know, significant. Yeah. Of course, sometimes we do some of both. Yeah. That's really what's done. There's there's nothing new or different for many, many years, and I was trained by professors who were trained. You know, I was trained 25, 30 years ago by professors that were trained 25 or 30 years earlier.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:22:34]:
Yeah. So really, what I'm doing now is no different than what happened 50 or 60 years ago. So that's why I think you should always see a young whipper snapper and then someone who's a sage old experienced doc and

Claudia [00:22:47]:
Uh-huh.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:22:48]:
And make sure that you have a list of all options.

Claudia [00:22:52]:
So we are back now after a fire alarm interlude, but thankfully, doctor Gross is safe. So just picking back up on our conversation. What I wanted to ask as well, obviously, people listening to longevity and lifestyle podcast are very keen on optimizing their health now to live really well for a longer period of time. Do you foresee or would you think that stem cell therapy would be for every human body because the body ages right over time? At some point, do you see that it's a a nice sort of top up of rejuvenation that is applicable across the board?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:23:31]:
Yeah. I do. I think that, you know, there may be more specific uses, you know, as we learn more about the individual, you know, cell signaling and and specific types of conjured exosomes by by how we might, manipulate stem cells to to give us these signals, which we're not doing at this time Mhmm. Except in the research setting. So I do. I think that for health span and healthy longevity, this would be a path towards, extending, our ability to fight off, stave off inflammation, and slow the aging process, which slows the disease formation process. Because those are really the same. Right? Inflammation begets aging and disease.

Claudia [00:24:23]:
So you set a point to stave off inflammation. So I just wanna jump into that for a second. So stave off inflammation, do you think that by having a higher or, like, having stem cell therapy that that helps with reducing inflammation, or because you mix it with the protocol of reducing inflammation from the lifestyle choices before having the stem cells? Or is there a a proven way that having stem cell therapy actually reduces inflammation in the body as well, separate to the lifestyle interventions?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:24:56]:
Yes. Separate from the lifestyle, what we call epigenetic, strategies to reduce inflammation. Biologics like stem cells or stem cell derived exosomes Mhmm. And certain peptides are known and have been shown to reduce inflammatory cell markers through different types of tests. So through through that proof, we have demonstrated that these types of treatments or augmentations Mhmm. Are helpful to reduce inflammation. And then we all know what inflammation does to us. So so by by that extension, we can say that these treatments do help slow disease formation and slow the aging decades for these things.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:25:55]:
We will at some point, but they will take a long time to do. But we do have them in animal models that have a shorter lifespan. Mhmm. So we can measure generations of them or or long standing, and and the results are wonderful in different species.

Claudia [00:26:10]:
Mhmm. So I'm just thinking, you know, for example, I have, like, a shoulder thing. I have a thing. So I'm like, you know, maybe one should consider sooner than later looking at stem cell therapy than, waiting for the degeneration to be so acute, right, that it's been more difficult to recover. Is there any is it to go down the stem cell?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:26:36]:
So we we do this, and and I'm accumulating a number of patients, to look at this. It's usually people in their thirties who might have been an athlete or maybe a college athlete or, you know, something like that or or had an old knee injury and had, like like, you did may had a arthroscopy surgery. And they've got a little bit of aches and pains, maybe when the weather changes a little something, and they know they've been told down the line they're gonna have accelerated arthritis. And I say that word funny because it's so vague. It really it's it's it's post traumatic degenerative osteoarthritis causing chondromalacia. Mhmm. But most doctors, that's a mouthful, so they don't say it. But, that would be the you're right.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:27:27]:
That's the ideal. Your idea, it converges with what we we believe. Is the ideal joint the joint is completely worn out and remodeled and and changed. Yeah. The less work the regenerate regenerative biologics have to do, the easier it is to do it. So what we have often is someone who comes in with a pretty bad joint for some reason. Mhmm. But they also have this old old knee injury.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:28:00]:
It's giving you a little bit of trouble, but they wouldn't have come to me otherwise. So what we normally do is, okay. Let's take care of your joint. But while you're sedated, let's do the other one that's only mildly bothersome. Since since you're already here, it's a little bit more just to do that. And we we do get clinical benefits in those patients early, but they're so focused on their other joint that, you know, they're happy with both. So, really, we need to look at those long term and see how they degenerate. Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:28:30]:
And, I'd love if we have enough to do a controlled study, right, where we have some patients who don't get the regenerative treatment. And they just go down the path of, you know, time and cortisone shots and things like that. And then some that do and then match those up 20, 30 years later.

Claudia [00:28:46]:
Yeah. Is anybody doing that research, the longitudinal ones as well? I mean, that's that's tricky. Right? And the funding and

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:28:53]:
it's I don't think it's very expensive to do. It's more of a, you know, just observation, which we would do with these patients anyway. But I'm not aware of anyone doing that yet. And it's very difficult because most studies require approval and funding, even a little funding. And, you know, the the at least least here in the states, the the governmental and politics and economics, don't make it easy.

Claudia [00:29:19]:
Yeah. There's definitely challenges in in that as well.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:29:22]:
Yeah. Let's

Claudia [00:29:23]:
talk about, enhancing things with biohacking. What type of biohacks do you love and do you recommend, and and what are the use cases?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:29:33]:
Well, bio biohacking, you know, can be, you know, something very simple and minimal, like like flossing extra, all the way up through, you know, doing an excess home IV, 4 times a year. So, I've I've just really enjoyed learning about all these things. It can be, you know, when people come in and we do a little bit of a, you know, slow your aging makeover, we biohack their exercise. You know? So when my come in and say, oh, I I run, you know, 3 miles every other day or something, we might put them into a high intensity burst type workout to get more out of the muscles. We want people using the larger body muscles to release the myokines, which stimulate, you know, cognitive enhancement and slow the development of cognitive disorders and other problems. We we work with supplements, very basic supplements we recommend. I don't actually have my own brand or anything, but, you know, we start out with some anti inflammatory supplements, just some basics, and we build on those and we can, you know, add the, you know, dihydroberine and the and, you know, all all the different, things that help ourselves and help our mitochondria like NMN. So although, you know, altogether, you know, these aren't exciting biohacking, they really can help Mhmm.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:30:58]:
Reduce inflammation towards that health span goal. But in terms of, you know, tech as as applied to biohacking outside of regenerative biologics, I'm very big on the sleep apps, some kind of tech, wearable tech, tracking your HRV, because the more measurements we have, the more we can tweak. And it's it's we might find something very odd and interesting on a subtle measurement.

Claudia [00:31:27]:
Yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:31:27]:
For example, I have patients and we've done some blood tests, and I have them on a good amount of, omega 3 and and fish oils daily. They still had low fish oil numbers, We had to even go up from there. Mhmm. Or fish oil numbers, but EHA and and and, the other omega threes.

Claudia [00:31:46]:
Yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:31:47]:
Or, we had someone, a very young, healthy, athletic guy who did the IV exosomes. He didn't really have that typical energy burst and cognitive burst and Mhmm. That people get. But his HRV, if if if if your audience knows that is it's, you know, heart rate variability, it's very subtle measure of sort of your nervous system balance and and your health, went from sixties on average, which is fantastic already, up into the nineties. So we see some very cool biohacking results, but everyone the key here is everyone's different. So we really have to practice what's called precision medicine and treat that individual, not just give okay. Here's the recipe that everyone takes. It could be Yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:32:36]:
It's gotta be customized.

Claudia [00:32:37]:
Which I think is so exciting, and that's the beauty of wearables. I actually have a separate, AI company that we're building, Athena Health Span, that will incorporate all of this. And we we are an AI SaaS solution for clinics. So, they're all so excited. They're like, how do we get this? Because we wanna help our patients understand what's happening before and after. And just seeing, you know, your sleep score is improving, your HRV is improving, your resting heart rate is going down. Your metabolic score is improving. It's just it's so rewarding.

Claudia [00:33:05]:
And, you know, we humans, we forget. You know? As you said, one comes in, it's like, oh, my shoulder is really sore. I was like, yeah. I have this knee injury for, like, like, 20 years, but my shoulders are open that's issues. Like, well, let's treat both. Right? And then they can see the difference, notice the difference too.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:33:18]:
Yeah. Well, that's fantastic. You know, AI has helped us so much, look at what is driving the outcome. Right? So what what the it helps us add weight to hey. It was it was this sleep that was causing most of your issue. You know? It was it wasn't this lack of exercise or something like that. So it what we learned from that is is really helpful.

Claudia [00:33:42]:
Yeah. Because it's it's just so so much data, right, to process, to understand, and so that's what AI does beautifully and and to help as a tool, right, a further tool in the practice to to see what's going on. Have you looked also into, like, red light therapy, sauna, cold exposure, and, HPS? You think of those?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:34:01]:
Big big fan of hot sauna and or or cold plunges and or contrast I don't offer those technologies at at my office or anything like that. I'm I'm more on the little bit old school, you know, interventional medicine side of things where we want to, you know, be able to do procedures for people.

Claudia [00:34:30]:
Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Maybe one day you'll see. Yes. What excites you most about the future of health and longevity in the years to come?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:34:41]:
Well, I, we talked a little bit earlier today on, you know, what's coming in regenerative medicine. And I'm really enjoying being sort of on that cusp and and pushing the envelope on that. It's it's almost tapping back into our own natural body's ability to fight off disease and heal that we've had all along. This isn't you know, we this is this new great technology in in one way and in other ways, it's tapping back into, our own youthful healing potential. When you think about it, when we talked about joints, those bone marrow stem cells created that joint in the first place. So we're tapping back into the factory specs and, just turning that factory back on for a bit to to get some better healing. If you think about it, Claudia, you know, when we were very young, you know, you were 3 year old, you scrape your knee on the ground, and you have a scab. And after your mother cleans it up, kisses it, and sends you on your way, you know, that scab is, like, healed in 3 days.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:35:45]:
You know, it's gone. But if you're if you're my age, you know, and you bruise your arm, man, it's there for 2 weeks. You know? And and and it's the same body. It's the same genes, but something is not the same over time. And that's the beauty of tapping back into our own, regenerative capabilities, our healing capabilities. And that is the most exciting thing because it helps us reduce the need for pharmaceuticals and it helps us slow disease and and the the pain burden, the cost burden that goes with managing those diseases, of course, to the detriment of big pharma, which is probably pushing to slow these things. But I think I see them dipping their toe in the regenerative waters. And as soon as they can monetize it, then, you know, they'll be they'll be right back in supporting it.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:36:36]:
They'll be in full force.

Claudia [00:36:37]:
I mean, same with the peptide scenario. Right? And the

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:36:40]:
Exactly like the peptides, which which are one of the very cool biohacking, elements that I failed to list earlier.

Claudia [00:36:48]:
Yeah. That's wonderful. For my listeners interested in understanding stem cells more, what online resource or books would you recommend they could start with?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:36:59]:
Well, there's a lot out there, and, you need to be a good consumer and good shopper. And the reason for this is, at least in the in the states, we really can't advertise. We can't advertise stem cells. We can't advertise any claims. We can't make any claims because we don't want to be noncompliant with governmental agencies, who determine what we can say and not say. Mhmm. I'll leave my editorial comment out for that. But, there are certain clinics outside the country that advertise in a blanket way.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:37:41]:
You know, they can cure or treat things. So you have to be a little bit cautious because we we don't make those claims. But, you you know, I would I would search the Internet. It's still a great tool. I would, look for all the options for particular problem that you seek to deal with, and then I would look for, you know, testimonials or case studies with results. Now, of course, one person's result doesn't guarantee someone else's. Mhmm. Like in anything in life.

Claudia [00:38:14]:
100%. Yeah.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:38:15]:
Why we have to restate that? I don't know, but it's true. And, there are, you know, seek seek the most educational, thing without the sales piece on the Internet. Mhmm. There's some wonderful YouTube videos, on, you know, the biology of stem cells and the types of issues. Don't be afraid to read a medical article and and, you know, at least skim the abstract and see what the conclusions are, to to gain an understanding. And then meet with someone or more than one someone and and ask the questions. Okay. What does this really mean? What are your personal results, doc? You know, what do you get? You know, there there are many regenerative medicine doctors in the states and well beyond.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:38:58]:
Europe and Asia is way way ahead of the states. Most of the good research comes out of Europe and Asia because it hasn't been suppressed there like it is in the states. The states are now pushing so much and catching up. So, hopefully, we'll get there as well. And then, you know, I think I think the you they're great YouTube videos. And some of them are pro regenerative and some of them are hey. It didn't really didn't do much for me. But you you should know the spectrum because this is not necessarily a cure all or panacea even though we touted all of the good things it can do.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:39:34]:
You know, it may not be right for everybody. Mhmm.

Claudia [00:39:37]:
Yeah. Exactly. I think everyone just needs to make their own judgment, right, and and have those conversations. So I think that's great advice. Where can people learn more about what you're up to in your clinic? And we can link everything in the show notes, website, or social media. Where would you like people to find you?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:39:55]:
Thank you very much. We're atrecelebrate.com and, on Instagram, we're atrecelebrate. And LinkedIn and Facebook, we celebrate. Everything's recelebrate, so you should be easy to find. And and, I love to meet new people, and and get to know them a little bit. And sometimes it takes more than one meeting. We do a lot of Zoom, or remote, consultations before anyone even thinks about coming here. I want them ready to go, and and we try to make it very easy for you.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:40:29]:
And luckily, most people don't mind coming to Vegas for a few days. And and if we need to help them, and they can enjoy a dinner in the show and and have have their niece spruced up while they're at it.

Claudia [00:40:41]:
Amazing. What a nice combination. Right? I think it's for travel. Wonderful. Do you have any final ask or recommendation or any parting thoughts or message for my audience today?

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:40:54]:
Just breathe and keep moving. If you could do, you know, this most simplest things to biohack and to promote your stem cell activity, to prevent cognitive decline, it's exercise and breathing. And ex of course, when you exercise, you have to breathe. So I force you to breathe. But if you can't exercise someday, just make sure to breathe. Use the full aspect of your lungs, lung, of lung and it does stimulate your brain stem and brain in in in ways that we haven't fully measured yet, but we we know and we see on, you know, functional MRIs and things like that. So those are very simple daily things you can do without much effort.

Claudia [00:41:39]:
Excellent. Thank you so much for coming on today and sharing your wisdom, and, congratulations on the work that you're doing and saving joints and other issues people are having.

DR. Jeffrey Gross [00:41:49]:
Thank you so much. One no joint left behind. Thank you so much, I appreciate it.

Claudia [00:41:54]:
Wonderful. Thank you.